Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

Thanks anyway, Nanook!
(No, you don't have 'em in the frozen tundra. dwl)


Mr Witchy says <span style="font-weight: bold">NO Golden Chinese Box turtles</span>! They're gorgeous and beautiful... but, he says, they're too finicky and he doesn't want so fussy a reptile here. dwl
He ways they are too fussy allover: fussy-fussy eaters, fussy with their preferred habitats, fussy-fussy egg layers, and far too fussy with whether or not they 'take a shine' to their keepers. Mr Witchy says <span style="font-weight: bold">mek dem Chinese turtles stay ah China</span>!

[SandiF]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

Witchy any confirmation? Is the turtle dead or just hibernating? I'm hoping you'd hold off digging a hole for Eddie ... lordy... what if it is just sleeping? The buried alive giving me the willies. Every now and then I'd see box turtles around the property woody area but it's usually during spring.

[Tulip]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

Witchy, I live in the south and my parents live on the Gulf Coast. I will look around and see what I can do for you.

As I said before, I know very little about turtles but I did read an article about turtles as pets after I first read your thread. Box turtles were listed but I'm not sure which kind. I just remember the article said box turtles grow to about 6 inches. (I was thinking they were large like the big ones at the zoo lol.)

To help me target my search, let me know if you are looking for a certain age range. It should be obvious since Edwina is 130, but the article also said that well cared for pet turtles are passed down generations in families. Also, it should go without saying that you should let me know anything else about them that is important to you.

[Magician]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

My parents always have turtles with yellow spots in their back yard in the spring. Central Jersey. Perhaps you could capture a couple in the spring if you see any in the grass.

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

Those are semi-aquatic turtles, Magix... like mud turtles. They require a bog and a pool or pond, as they spend much time in the water, unlike my land turtles. Spotted turtles are cool pets, especially for kids, though. . But they can't live in the same dry land habitat that box turtles live in.

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tulip</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Witchy, I live in the south and my parents live on the Gulf Coast. I will look around and see what I can do for you.

As I said before, I know very little about turtles but I did read an article about turtles as pets after I first read your thread. Box turtles were listed but I'm not sure which kind. I just remember the article said box turtles grow to about 6 inches. (I was thinking they were large like the big ones at the zoo lol.)

To help me target my search, let me know if you are looking for a certain age range. It should be obvious since Edwina is 130, but the article also said that well cared for pet turtles are passed down generations in families. Also, it should go without saying that you should let me know anything else about them that is important to you. </div></div>
Tulip.. thank you for any attempts to help me!

Let's start with this: A box turtle is unique among turtles and tortoises in that it's plastron (bottom shell) is hinged, so that it can close it's shell tightly and completely against predators. All box turtles have rather highly domed carapaces (top shells) with the turtle's first central scute (connecting scale-like parts that make up the top shell) at an angle of more than 50 degrees and then next central scutes usually flattened. The plastral scute formula varies among species, but in general, the largest, second largest, and third largest scutes - in order - are, respectively, the anal scute, the abdominal scute, and then the gular scute.

It's very difficult to tell a box turtle's age with any certainty. Even experts can't do it, and disagree on how best to do it. Don't worry too much about it. In general, box turtles grow to be about 6 to 8 inches big, so any turtle that size is fully an adult. Any box turtle less than 2.5 to 3 inches is a baby. One 3 or 4 inches is probably a juvenile, and anything 4 to 5 inches is probably a 'teenager'. A five inch turtle is a young adult. It's possible that a turtle has had it's growth stunted due to poor nutrition... but that usually happens in captivity when the turtle's keeper doesn't know the proper nutrition for the turtle; in the wild, in normal conditions, there is sufficient supply of food that this won't happen.

A turtle should look healthy to you -- clear bright eyes that track movement of your finger, no runny eyes or nose, no mucus from eyes or nose or mouth corners, it should either be interested in you or fearful and shell in. It's beak should look 'right'. It's legs should look 'right' and so should it's toes and claws, and so should it's tail. It's belly should look fairly clean, and so should it's top. Some dirt or debris is okay, but it really ought not to be filthy nor should it have any bodily fluids or waste on it. This may seem ridiculously obvious... but... the turtle ought to have four legs and one tail and no wounds. BUT, this said, I'd say that if a turtle was found that had a completely-healed injury like, for example, three legs (like Edwina had), I'd take it anyhow... as a three-legged turtle really ought not to be left out in the wild. Many turtles lose a leg to dogs and raccoons. Even box turtles often lose a leg to a dog or a raccoon, because although they can completely shell in, they can't do it while they're running away. Often they lose the last leg they try to drag into their shell before slamming their shell shut.

I bet you never thought you'd know so much about box turtles before, Tulip!

If you an help me get a turtle or two, I'd be very grateful... and I will gladly pay you for everything, including your time.

I can tell you how to package and ship the little critter(s) so they arrive here safely and alive.

Many thanks!

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SandiF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Witchy any confirmation? Is the turtle dead or just hibernating? I'm hoping you'd hold off digging a hole for Eddie ... lordy... what if it is just sleeping? The buried alive giving me the willies. Every now and then I'd see box turtles around the property woody area but it's usually during spring.
</div></div>
Yeah, it gives ME the willies, too. I had a bad nightmare again last night... I was buried alive and couldn't claw my way out of all the dirt above me, pressing against my face. UGH! *shiver*

No confirmation from the zookeeper. Eddie could either be hibernating or dead. Trying to warm her up and wake her up out of hibernation could, in and of itself, kill her from the shock. There is nothing to do but wait 'til spring and wait to see if Eddie wakes up out of hibernation. If she does not wake by April, then she is dead. I must keep her until April, lest I accidentally bury the poor animal alive. I couldn't do that to an animal I've never seen before, never mind to an animal that I have loved for twenty years!

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WitchyOoman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Let's start with this: A box turtle is unique among turtles and tortoises in that it's plastron (bottom shell) is hinged, so that it can close it's shell tightly and completely against predators. All box turtles have rather highly domed carapaces (top shells) with the turtle's first central scute (connecting scale-like parts that make up the top shell) at an angle of more than 50 degrees and then next central scutes usually flattened. The plastral scute formula varies among species, but in general, the largest, second largest, and third largest scutes - in order - are, respectively, the anal scute, the abdominal scute, and then the gular scute.

It's very difficult to tell a box turtle's age with any certainty. Even experts can't do it, and disagree on how best to do it. Don't worry too much about it. In general, box turtles grow to be about 6 to 8 inches big, so any turtle that size is fully an adult. Any box turtle less than 2.5 to 3 inches is a baby. One 3 or 4 inches is probably a juvenile, and anything 4 to 5 inches is probably a 'teenager'. A five inch turtle is a young adult. It's possible that a turtle has had it's growth stunted due to poor nutrition... but that usually happens in captivity when the turtle's keeper doesn't know the proper nutrition for the turtle; in the wild, in normal conditions, there is sufficient supply of food that this won't happen.

A turtle should look healthy to you -- clear bright eyes that track movement of your finger, no runny eyes or nose, no mucus from eyes or nose or mouth corners, it should either be interested in you or fearful and shell in. It's beak should look 'right'. It's legs should look 'right' and so should it's toes and claws, and so should it's tail. It's belly should look fairly clean, and so should it's top. Some dirt or debris is okay, but it really ought not to be filthy nor should it have any bodily fluids or waste on it. This may seem ridiculously obvious... but... the turtle ought to have four legs and one tail and no wounds. BUT, this said, I'd say that if a turtle was found that had a completely-healed injury like, for example, three legs (like Edwina had), I'd take it anyhow... as a three-legged turtle really ought not to be left out in the wild. Many turtles lose a leg to dogs and raccoons. Even box turtles often lose a leg to a dog or a raccoon, because although they can completely shell in, they can't do it while they're running away. Often they lose the last leg they try to drag into their shell before slamming their shell shut. </div></div>
Also... (more)

When you hold a healthy turtle in your hand, it should feel very heavy for it's size. It should not be lightweight. It's legs - and it's tail - should not be shriveled. It should not be dehydrated. It should look hydrated and healthy. It's skin should feel soft when you gently stroke it with a finger, not dried-out.

I am hoping for an adult or two (even if a young adult), not babies or juveniles.

I am also hoping for one male and one female, if at all possible... I'll post about sexing (discovering which gender) box turtles in another post.

[Nanook]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

This turtle education is fascinating Witchy!

[Tulip]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

Witchy, i am finding all the information interesting. The only thing I had slight reservations about when reading was determining how pliable the turtle skin was. I then remembered that I had no problem holding a boa constrictor lol.

Alright, so keep the info. coming. Do you have a target date in mind?

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tulip</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Witchy, i am finding all the information interesting. <span style="color: #CC0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">The only thing I had slight reservations about when reading was determining how pliable the turtle skin was. I then remembered that I had no problem holding a boa constrictor</span></span> lol.

Alright, so keep the info. coming. Do you have a target date in mind? </div></div>
A boa constrictor can wrap around you and squish you to death. An innocent little box turtle can do you no harm at all... all a box turtle can do to you is hiss at you. dwl

I'm still considering all of my potential options, so I haven't gotten to picking a date in my mind yet, no.

Remember how soft and nice that boa constrictor's skin felt? Well, a healthy box turtle's skin should feel similarly nice and soft.
(whispering: Like good leather - but don't say that word in front of them! )

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WitchyOoman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
all a box turtle can do to you is hiss at you. dwl </div></div>
Well, okay... a box turtle can also nip you if it thinks your finger is food. But such a turtle would never intentionally bite; it just might, if it's hungry enough, mistake a wiggling finger for a moving tasty something and chomp down. But as turtles have no teeth, only the beak pinch could happen, and that's a relatively minor owchie.

[Magician]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WitchyOoman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">all a box turtle can do to you is hiss at you. dwl</div></div>

[Stormmey]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold">Remember how soft and nice that boa constrictor's skin felt? </span>Well, a healthy box turtle's skin should feel similarly nice and soft.
(whispering: Like good leather - but don't say that word in front of them </div></div>

the above bolded jumped right out at me and <span style="font-style: italic">shudder</span> great info though witchy!!

btw are turtles considered reptiles or amphideans? caan bodda google it

[WitchyOoman]

Re: Dead or hibernating? (We can't tell...)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MrsStormmey1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold">Remember how soft and nice that boa constrictor's skin felt? </span>Well, a healthy box turtle's skin should feel similarly nice and soft.
(whispering: Like good leather - but don't say that word in front of them </div></div>

the above bolded jumped right out at me and <span style="font-style: italic">shudder</span> great info though witchy!!

btw are turtles considered reptiles or amphideans? caan bodda google it </div></div>
Turtles are classified as reptiles, but only because they're closest to reptiles than anything else, even though exactly like most reptile families. Turtles are nothing like amphibians. Turtles are so ancient, really, that they are unlike anything else left alive today.