Affirmative Action: Who Should qualify for university scholarships?

[Tropicana]

Okay let's see what blu and others say about this one.

This is specific to the USA. Do the children of Black African, Jamaican, and other Caribbean immigrants qualify for scholarships Affirmative Action scholarships? These were designed to help African American young people. Should our children qualify?

[franksterr]

Okay let's see what blu and others say about this one.

This is specific to the USA. Do the children of Black African, Jamaican, and other Caribbean immigrants qualify for scholarships Affirmative Action scholarships? These were designed to help African American young people. Should our children qualify?

Yes they should.

[Tropicana]

Why?

[twiney]

Why?

why not?

[Tropicana]

I am not going to weigh in on this issue. I want other people's opinions and reasons first.

[kia027]

I am not going to way in on this issue. I want other people's opinions and reasons first.

I can not resist this.. How are you going to get other people's opinions when you have most on ignore?

btw caribbean peoples are african american because the caribbean is part of the americas

[Tropicana]

Let me prime the pump with a couple of different POV.

President Barack Obama, whose father was from Kenya, was immediately called an “affirmative action president” and the “poster child” for affirmative action. In this story, I set out to find whether immigrant blacks are benefiting disproportionally from affirmative action programs and scholarships that were set up to reduce racial disparities between whites and African-Americans. If so, what are the consequences?In March of this year, Harvard announced that over eleven and a half percent of its admitted class is African-American. But how many fit into the traditional definition of “African-American,” referring to the descendants of American slaves?
As an undergraduate attending college under an economically directed affirmative action program, my personal experience was that the majority of beneficiaries of the scholarship were not African-American, rather, they were immigrant blacks.
That experience was reflected in a study conducted by Pamela R. Bennett of Johns Hopkins University and Amy Lutz of Syracuse University, which found that African-Americans are enrolled at selective colleges at a rate of 2.4 percent compared to 9.2 percent for immigrant blacks.
“Things such as affirmative action were designed to redress the history of African-American inequality. But that emphasis on African-American shifted certainly by the late 60s and early 1970s whereby affirmative action in many respects represented diversity and the label diversity was used to incorporate black immigrants from the Caribbean and Africa,” explained Hunter College, professor of Africana studies Anthony Brown.
The discrepancies are not only found in selective institutions, but at colleges and universities across the country. An Economic Policy Institute brief released earlier this year found that a little more than sixteen percent of U.S born blacks in the 25-years-and-older population attain a bachelor’s degree or higher.
Compare these numbers to African immigrants who achieve the same level of education at a rate 36.6 percent, and the one in five West Indian immigrants who have college degrees.

Aneicka Bookal, who immigrated to the U.S. from Jamaica and attended university in Michigan has a different perspective. “Regardless of the minority status that African-Americans hold in this country due to years of racial, socioeconomic, and political oppression in this country, there is a completely different barrier that you have to cross as an immigrant. As a consequence, the sense of unity and community that you would feel with someone who shares your racial background is completely different,” she said.

http://fi2w.org/2011/07/07/podcast-t...lege-campuses/

[franksterr]

Why?

Because they are BLACK?

What gave you this idea

"These were designed to help African American young people"

unless of course you consider white (European) woman African Americans?

[franksterr]

btw caribbean peoples are african american because the caribbean is part of the americas

Good point............have pint

[Tropicana]

I can not resist this.. How are you going to get other people's opinions when you have most on ignore?

I have enough who are NOT on ignore to have a meaniful discussion.

btw caribbean peoples are african american because the caribbean is part of the americas

That is not the definition of an "African American"....and I am not going to derail this discussion by debating that with you.

[Tropicana]

Because they are BLACK?

What gave you this idea

This:

Affirmative action is an outcome of the 1960's Civil Rights Movement, intended to provide equal opportunities for members of minority groups and women in education and employment. In 1961, President Kennedy was the first to use the term "affirmative action" in an Executive Order that directed government contractors to take "affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, ornational origin." The Executive Order also established the President’s Committee on Equal Employment Opportunity, now known as the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC).

People of Caribbean descent would fall under this but read on....

Affirmative action policies initially focused on improving opportunities for African Americans in employment and education. The Supreme Court's Brown v. Board of Education decision in 1954 outlawing school segregation and the Civil Rights Act of 1964 improved life prospects for African Americans. In 1965, however, only five percent of undergraduate students, one percent of law students, and two percent of medical students in the country were African American. President Lyndon Johnson, an advocate for affirmative action, signed an Executive Order in 1965 that required government contractors to use affirmative action policies in their hiring to increase the number of minority employees.

In the following years, colleges and universities began adopting similar recruitment policies, and over time the enrollment rates for African American and Latino students increased steadily. Despite the efforts that have been made to establish equal opportunity, gaps in college enrollment between minority and white students remain. According to data from the National Center on Education Statistics (NCES), in 2007, 70 percent of white high school graduates immediately enrolled in college, compared to 56 percent of African American graduates and 61 percent of Hispanic graduates. More recent data from NCES reports some changes in this gap, most notably for African American students. The updated report finds that in 2011, 69 percent of white high school graduates immediately enrolled in college, compared to 65 percent of African American graduates and 63 percent of Hispanic graduates.

http://www.ncsl.org/research/education/affirmative-action-overview.aspx

[Tropicana]

Here is another POV:

Professor: Affirmative Action is Helping Too Many Black Immigrants, Not Enough African-Americans



Indiana University professor Kevin Brown is raising a few eyebrows by questioning whether affirmative action is working as it is intended.
Brown is in favor of including race as a factor in college admissions, but says he has issues with how affirmative action is currently being implemented.

Brown told Business Insider that colleges are giving fewer spots to “traditional African-American” students, whose parents endured discrimination in this country, and more to black immigrants.

Are they giving the spots or are the students qualifying for the spots based on their marks?

He points out that black immigrants tend to have higher incomes than non-immigrant blacks, leading to a stronger college application. Brown believes that this is why we are seeing more black immigrants than traditional African-American students at some of the nation’s most elite colleges and universities.

One study found that 40 percent of Black college freshmen on Ivy League campuses were Black immigrants, even though they only account for 18% of black 18 and 19 year olds.

The question is how many of them are there base don marks and what percentage are there due to affirmative action.

“Traditional African-Americans … clearly have a far greater claim to being members of a group that has suffered from the history of discrimination based on race and ethnicity,” wrote Brown in a 2011 article in the Michigan School of Law.
Since the main goal of affirmative action is to make up for past discrimination, why are black immigrants being included as eligible candidates for affirmative action considerations?


Harvard professors Lani Guinier and Henry Louis Gates Jr.brought up the issue in 2004, noting at the time that two thirds of Harvard black students were immigrants, children of immigrants, or children of interracial couples.

http://www.yourblackworld.net/2013/05/black-news/professor-affirmative-action-is-helping-too-many-black-immigrants-not-enough-african-americans/

[Tropicana]

This has the same POV.

As greater numbers of non*white immigrants enter the country, our racial justice policies are leaving behind
longstanding racial minority populations.
When Kwasi Enin—the Ghanaian*American student accepted by all eight Ivy League schools—first made
headlines, he probably never expected to ignite a national conversation about race and ethnic relations. Why
would he, given his rank among the top of his class and his stellar 2250 SAT score? By all accounts, he represents
the typical Ivy League*bound high school senior.
But Enin is “not a typical African*American kid,” as some have characterized him. This description has been rightly
criticized as an ill*phrased reference to the student’s immigrant origins that draws on perceived frictions between
African immigrants and black Americans, especially in discussions of higher education. Driving these perceived
tensions is the notion that immigrants are benefitting from racial justice policies—like affirmative action—that were
originally intended to make up for historical wrongs committed against black Americans.
This emphasis on the black American*African divide misses a larger question about immigration’s role in the
implementation of racial justice policies, and how these policies have been redefined to foster racial diversity. As
greater numbers of non*white immigrants have entered the country, longstanding racial minority populations have
become increasingly multi*ethnic. Our racial diversity policies should be reconstructed to reflect these
demographic realities.
Since the 1960s, large*scale migration to the United States has facilitated the arrival of new,
mostly non*white immigrant groups—from Latin America, East Asia, the Caribbean, and Africa
—which has blurred the lines between immigrant and “racial” minorities.
Presidents John F. Kennedy and Lyndon B. Johnson established and expanded affirmative action via Executive
Order in 1961 and 1967, respectively. Although codified to limit discrimination because of race, creed, color, or
national origin, the policy was primarily intended as one of racial justice, providing historically disadvantaged
minority groups—especially black Americans—equal opportunity in the fields of employment and higher education.
Challenges to the policy over the years have broadened its scope, however. Most famously, the Supreme Court’s
landmark 2003 ruling in Grutter v. Bollinger—which upheld the affirmative action admissions policy at the University
of Michigan Law School—did not uphold racial justice as a strict scrutiny standard of interest for the federal
government. Affirmative action became a matter of racial diversity, shifting the policy’s original purpose to
encompass both longstanding racial minorities and, importantly, a growing number of non*white immigrant groups.
Since the 1960s, large*scale migration to the United States has facilitated the arrival of new, mostly non*white
immigrant groups—from Latin America, East Asia, the Caribbean, and Africa—which has blurred the lines between
immigrant and “racial” minorities. A recent report by the Migration Policy Institute notes that the 3.3 million foreign*
born blacks living in the United States represent eight percent of all black Americans; these immigrants’ 813,000
second*generation children represent 12 percent of all young black children.
Similarly, foreign*born Mexicans constitute 34 percent of the Mexican*American population and a growing






The evidence shows that, at least among elite universities, immigrant youth are benefitting from these racial
justice*turned*racial diversity policies. In a 2007 analysis of the National Longitudinal Survey of Freshmen, Princeton sociologist Douglas Massey and colleagues found that black students with immigrant origins are overrepresented among students in top colleges. Among the study’s top 28 most selective colleges, 27 percent of black freshmen are of immigrant origin; the figure was at 35 percent for those entering the top 10 most selective institutions. Among the Ivy League institutions in the sample, first* and second *generation blacks made up 41 percent of the population.

Interesting no one ever says that WHITE students are overrepresented. If the Black students have the marks to qualify why is this an issue?

It is not my desire to condemn incoming flows of migrants for restricting longstanding American minority groups’ life chances. Many immigrant groups—especially if they are also visibly racial minorities—experience discrimination similar to longer*standing racial groups. Nevertheless, the original stated purpose of affirmative action—racial justice with respect to righting the wrongs of American slavery, colonial violence against American Indians, and Jim Crow segregation—may have been forgotten by the inclusion of immigrants and their children in the categories eligible for special consideration.

In any event, the entrenched poverty and unique problems of the most vulnerable longstanding minority populations in the United States are not going to be alleviated by diversity policies given the growth of an increasingly large, middle*class, and multi*ethnic non*white immigrant population.


New policies are needed that target the most historically disadvantaged racial minorities in this country, while also maintaining the ethically distinct, but also important, value of diversity. As legal scholars Kevin Brown and Jeannine Bell have noted, it may be that we require a new name for historically disadvantaged racial minorities. They propose the term “ascendants” to refer to black Americans who “experienced America’s racially discriminatory history their entire lives or were born from parents who were generally considered black at the time that affirmative
action was adopted.” This proposed category is designed to provide a way for admissi

http://scholar.harvard.edu/files/asad/files/asad_2014_0.pdf

Okay those are the issues....reactions?

[franksterr]

This:



People of Caribbean descent would fall under this but read on....

http://www.ncsl.org/research/education/affirmative-action-overview.aspx

Affirmative action is an outcome of the 1960's Civil Rights Movement, intended to provide equal opportunities for members of minority groups and women in education and employment. In 1961, President Kennedy was the first to use the term "affirmative action" in an Executive Order that directed government contractors to take "affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, ornational origin." The Executive Order also established the President’s Committee on Equal Employment Opportunity, now known as the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC)

without regard to..........NATIONAL ORIGIN
That should answer your queries as to why, immigrants should be eligible for Affirmative Action.....as well as why it was not exclusively meant for native born African Americans.

Do you comprehend or even read what you are posting

[kia027]

I have enough who are NOT on ignore to have a meaniful discussion.


.

Yes franksterr and blugiant