If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

[britisha]

by another man in a relationship..Could this affect his respect for her if they get into a relationship after she left the abuser?

[kia027]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

if she has taken the time for herself to understand why she allowed herself to be abused and fixed the underlying causes why not?

[britisha]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kia</div><div class="ubbcode-body">if she has taken the time for herself to understand why she allowed herself to be abused and fixed the underlying causes why not? </div></div>

I wasn't even thinking along these lines, about her having allowed herself to be abused, but that is an interesting position to view this from.

I really was thinking about the man, who having known her past situation (depending on his sense of self-worth) might use it against her later, not necessarily as physical abuse...for eg, if something crops us he will be the first one to throw it in &quot;her teeth&quot; like &quot;dass why Johnny used to beat yuh&quot; or something like that..

Now, I personally don't share the view that it is all women who &quot;allowed themselves to be abused&quot; in such relationships....we all say how easy it would be for us to remove ourselves from such situation should they occur in our lives, but it is easier said than done.

Many of these women have no where to go, no support system, no money and children in the union to worry about...so while she wants to get out of such situation, circumstances don't allow it.

So now, it boils down to true love, if the man really loves the woman, could he close his eyes on her past and love and respect her for who she is...baggage or no baggage.


Consider men have gone to jail for awful stuff, but oomens still love AND RESPECT THEM as if nothing happened, I see the reverse when it comes on to the scenario I describe. Does spousal abuse carry a stigma?

[LiteBlonde]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: britisha</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[quote=Kia] Does spousal abuse carry a stigma?
</div></div>

Me think it depends on the people involved.

Some women, although them will try and move on, the nightmare lives on, so them repeat behaviors which will create discomfort in a new relationship.

Any man who &quot;loves&quot; his woman, will show her respect and understand her pain, so support instead of ridicule her.

IMO, women who still love and support her man who went to jail should be commended cause that tish can't be easy. However, the women who love and RESPECT them <span style="font-weight: bold">as if nothing happens, should be publicly flogged.</span>

Any woman who loves herself, respects herself and is genuine to herself will NEVER stay in an abused situation. Kids or no kids, even if she have to be homeless, she gone like Space Shuttle Columbia.

Me know that every woman doesn't have it in them to move on, same with men, not everyone has it in them to be heartless, selfish and mean.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: britisha</div><div class="ubbcode-body">by another man in a relationship..Could this affect his respect for her if they get into a relationship after she left the abuser?

</div></div>if he is immature enough to some how blam,e her for it.
Any man tha allow that to negatively affect th relation ship is an abuser himself.probably worse than th previous one.
A ver high percent of women are victims of abuse. some don't evn realize that is what they are coping with. My view of women survive spousal abuse without resorting to violence,is that they are very strong. The problem is that the majority really believe the opposite. It is so easy to lose your sanity under those conditions that to survive mentally intact is an achievement that requires enormous strength.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

why should she be flogged?
should she be flogged for doing the best she can tomaintain ther sanity?/ That is one of the survival mechanism victims experience.That is the tool they use toi avoidkilling the perp. It seem strange, but human psyche is not common sense

[britisha]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">why should she be flogged?
should she be flogged for doing the best she can tomaintain ther sanity?/ That is one of the survival mechanism victims experience.That is the tool they use toi avoidkilling the perp. It seem strange, but human psyche is not common sense </div></div>

I don't think you read what Dotcom stated. Check it agen Doc.

[britisha]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DotCom</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: britisha</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[quote=Kia] Does spousal abuse carry a stigma?
</div></div>

Me think it depends on the people involved.

Some women, although them will try and move on, the nightmare lives on, so them repeat behaviors which will create discomfort in a new relationship.

Any man who &quot;loves&quot; his woman, will show her respect and understand her pain, so support instead of ridicule her.

IMO, women who still love and support her man who went to jail should be commended cause that tish can't be easy. However, the women who love and RESPECT them <span style="font-weight: bold">as if nothing happens, should be publicly flogged.</span>

Any woman who loves herself, respects herself and is genuine to herself will NEVER stay in an abused situation. Kids or no kids, even if she have to be homeless, she gone like Space Shuttle Columbia.

Me know that every woman doesn't have it in them to move on, same with men, not everyone has it in them to be heartless, selfish and mean. </div></div>

Well said !! Agree with everything you said....well not the flogging and still feel that if she is about to become homeless, for the kids sake she might still stay in the dysfunctional relationship..even to the point of losing her life...

Back to the man, you said it, it depends on the people involved. If the man has his personal issues, him nat gwine respect the woman as he really should, and might resort to ridicule, something that I have witnessed from a wukliss man..

[britisha]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: britisha</div><div class="ubbcode-body">by another man in a relationship..Could this affect his respect for her if they get into a relationship after she left the abuser?

</div></div>if he is immature enough to some how blame her for it.
Any man that allow that to negatively affect the relation ship is an abuser himself.probably worse than the previous one.
A very high percent of women are victims of abuse. some don't even realize that is what they are coping with. My view of women survive spousal abuse without resorting to violence,is that they are very strong. The problem is that the majority really believe the opposite. It is so easy to lose your sanity under those conditions that to survive mentally intact is an achievement that requires enormous strength. </div></div>

Some salient points you make her Doc...I don't know if her history might negatively impact the relationship to the extent that the man could be automatically seen as an abuser himself..I disagree..if he disrespects her because of the history, then it only means that he is not prepared to handle the relationship WITH HER.

Remember these women might still have baggage carrying into the new relationship...might even want to take it out on the other man, what they couldn't do to the prior abuser...<span style="font-weight: bold">&quot;any man whey lick mi agen yuh si&quot;</span>

I agree that any woman who survives spousal abuse is strong [and vice versa for the men] *There is a man on my job now who is going through his own malawkahh..actually two men right now....

I personally know of two women..edit editwho were the victims of spousal beatings...literally...the police was involved...cannot go into details for one doesn't know who reads here...anyway..one of them was almost killed, couldn't even feed herself, but she survived, and quit the job...the other one turned into a piece of work...ugly and nasty, unbearable and unpleasant to be around...here's the clinchah..


Some employees were even whispering that they could understand the abusive husband's resort to physical violence.. well, she lost respect among her co-workers...was forced into therapy, and became much better...but the emotional scars seem lasting....sad, sadder than I can say here..the last time I heard about her, she was not married...but if say, she were to...I don't think she could do justice to the relationship, she is so emotionally scarred.

So in answer to my question, I do think it carries a stigma, whether it affects the respect that the new significant other might show is another matter.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

Abused wamen are usually attracted to other abusers,and abusers,are also attracted to women witnh low self esteem.

[britisha]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Abused wamen are usually attracted to other abusers,and abusers,are also attracted to women with low self esteem. </div></div>

...and what is your point, isn't that begging the question?

Are we to conclude that all women who are abused are women with low self-esteem? A wha yuh a talk seh Doc?

The woman's <span style="text-decoration: underline">self-esteem</span> or that of abused men for that matter, doesn't enter the picture IMO..I'm surprised that you said that...it is as if you were to send your child to school and a bully picks on the child simply because &quot;he/she is a bully&quot;...has nothing to do with your child's self-esteem...until someone breaks the bully's nose; then the scenario changes...the bully quickly learns that it can swing either way..many women put out the light of their abusers, nothing to do with self-esteem.

While the woman's self-esteem<span style="font-weight: bold"> might</span> be affected AFTER the abuse starts, especially if she<span style="font-weight: bold"> cannot</span> leave, but stay and tolerate the abuse, it is unreasonable to say that it is her low self-esteem that caused her to be in such predicament from the get-go.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

What you blaming me for? Idon't make it up!! It si allabout human psychology. We are usually attracted to mates who reminds us of most comfortable surroundings. That usually means women are mostly attracted to people with the behavior of their father. So women that grows uop with a very strong will father, are usualluy attracted to mwn that are strong willed, unless they discover the problem before they chose a mate. Usually they don't see it as soo bad until the mate start doing it too often. By they meet the mate they are already supressed, by their father. This gives thenm a lower than acceptable self evaluation. the mate on the other hand, wil avoid women that does not have these charasterics. they stiklk don;'t realize that they are playing out the classic domestic abuse setup,until it is too late. Even after they break up, unless she get appropriate counselling, she is likely to be attracted to the same tyope 0f person. The reason, the men does not appear to be like that on the surface. Just liek their father,but they don;'t see it. every body else loves the wau theirm fater behave, except tyem, because he behaves different at home with his family.

[dearjohn]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DotCom</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> .......same with men, not everyone has it in them to be heartless, selfish and mean. </div></div>

Wow! Wouldn't you say, this sounds a lot like a backhanded compliment to men?

[Pepper]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: britisha</div><div class="ubbcode-body">



I really was thinking about the man, who having known her past situation (depending on his sense of self-worth) might use it against her later, not necessarily as physical abuse...for eg, if something crops us he will be the first one to throw it in &quot;her teeth&quot; like &quot;dass why Johnny used to beat yuh&quot; or something like that..


</div></div>

If he says something like that, then he is an abuser as well.

[britisha]

Re: If a man knows that a woman was a victim of abuse

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What you blaming me for? Idon't make it up!! It si allabout human psychology. We are usually attracted to mates who reminds us of most comfortable surroundings. That usually means women are mostly attracted to people with the behavior of their father. So women that grows uop with a very strong will father, are usualluy attracted to mwn that are strong willed, unless they discover the problem before they chose a mate. Usually they don't see it as soo bad until the mate start doing it too often. By they meet the mate they are already supressed, by their father. This gives thenm a lower than acceptable self evaluation. the mate on the other hand, wil avoid women that does not have these charasterics. they stiklk don;'t realize that they are playing out the classic domestic abuse setup,until it is too late. Even after they break up, unless she get appropriate counselling, she is likely to be attracted to the same tyope 0f person. The reason, the men does not appear to be like that on the surface. Just liek their father,but they don;'t see it. every body else loves the wau theirm fater behave, except tyem, because he behaves different at home with his family. </div></div>

Doc, can you make the effort to say what you say with some clarity? Break down the above for mi... Thanks.

Mi manage fi mek hout ah it dat women or men and women for that matter are usually attracted to spouses/mates who remind them of the parent of the opposite sex [Psych 101]...so the Psych text books say...an in my cases it look soh,....mi faddah was verrry black, so I tend to see verrry black men as attractive...it mighta bi a coincidence but a juss soh....


Nevertheless, that is not what the discussion is about...I cannot understand what having a &quot;strong-willed father&quot; has to do with anything in the discussion...unless you wish to clarify some more Doc..I might get to see your point...and duh please be clear and leave no room for doubt..for I am inclined to think that what you are saying is that women with strong-willed fathers are more likely than NOT to get a sound whooping from their husbands..whether he is a bully or not..

If, IF a child comes from a dysfunctional and abusive home/background, chances are that the child will MOST LIKELY <span style="font-weight: bold">(there are exceptions to every &quot;rule&quot</span> perpetuate the learned mal-adaptive behaviour UNTIL THE CYCLE IS BROKEN, and not passed on to the other generations...take welfare collecting as one example where nobody in the family works.. ..Or a girl or boy who sees the father beating the mother or vice versa might tend to adapt the behaviour, and do the same thing later whether by becoming the victim or the abuser...

You said, and I quote <span style="font-weight: bold">&quot;Abused women are always attracted to other abusers and abusers are also attracted to women with low self-esteem..</span>


I did ask about women and I did ask about &quot;abused women&quot; but how does your statement relate to women who were NEVER abused until the first abuse occurred...Were these women also suffering from low self esteem and automatically selected a man who they knew would eventually beat them, even if they came from a SOLID two parent healthy background?

Are you aware that some of the higher incidences of spousal abuse occur in ARRANGED MARRIAGES? Did you know that? Did you know that in such arrangements the woman is a virtual slave and must bow to the wishes and COMMANDS OF THE HUSBAND or get a solid beating is she doesn't?...In such cases, how does the woman's self-esteem come into the equation? How? In some male-dominated cultures, spousal abuse is a cultural thing...EXPECTED AND TOLERATED in some cultures....eg in Africa...

When I was there this man killed his beautiful Arabic wife, and never spent a day in jail, why? Why? The response was he didn't want another man to look at her she was too beautiful...and figure out the insanity from there....Dr. Dudd, would you in all professional honesty say that this victim's self esteem feature here?

I also see a problem with the word &quot;always&quot; and this again should be challenged; for the simple reason that this is not always the case.

In the case of the first two examples I gave, these two women have reached the pinnacle of their profession, were looked up to and respected...so any damaging of the self-esteem has to be after, not before...this is still trying to figure out what you are saying Doc...so do tell, when the self-esteem damage occur, during childhood, before the abuse, after the abuse or all 3?

back to the original question..