WELCOME...*MONK*...F&R Summer Feature Presentation!

[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Compray</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Monk, who is Buddha? </div></div>

look into one of these and you might catch one

[Compry]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

Monk, for the sake of this discussion, instead of &quot;googling&quot; I asked the question. Since I did not understand your response, I decided to google and found this link. I will continue to search others but wanted to know if I was on the right track.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Buddha is a person who has achieved the spiritual state of bodhi. The word buddha literally means &quot;the awakened one&quot; – someone who has no ignorance and can see the universe as it really is. People who have achieved this state can be called a buddha. There are many buddhas, and no one has the right to say, &quot;I am the one and only buddha.&quot;

The religion of Buddhism takes its teaching from spiritual guidance. It holds that everything in the universe is linked and related, but it is to ourselves that we must ultimately answer. If we harm another person, we are harming ourselves, because everything is linked. This is also where the idea of karma comes into play; what we give out, we shall receive, and vice versa.

Siddattha Gotama, an Indian prince, is considered the original teacher of Buddhism. During his lifetime, he reached an enlightened state. Until his 29th birthday, Siddattha led a luxurious life, as befits royalty. Slowly, up until that age, he began to realize that everything in the universe will eventually die. Sorrow and pain are a prelude to death. Siddattha decided to find a cure for humanity's sorrow and became a seeker of peace.

On his travels, Siddattha learned the teachings and philosophies of the most prominent thinkers and spiritual wisemen of the time, but none of the answers he gained satisfied him. It was a case of the blind leading the blind. Siddattha soon joined a group of five pupils of a former teacher. They tried to become in touch with their senses through abstinence and penance.

Siddattha practiced this form for six years. He abstained until his body became shrunken and withered. His veins protruded from his skin, which had dried up. For the six years he suffered, he eventually realized the absolute futility of complete abstinence and penance.

Taking guidance from all his findings, Siddattha came upon the Middle Path of thinking, or the Majjhima Patipada. Sitting under a Bodhi tree in deep meditation, he attained enlightenment and became buddha. Buddha taught that suffering was due to the selfishness of clinging to life and its passions. As buddha, Siddattha taught his philosophy until the age of 80, when he passed into Nirvana.

Buddha was therefore a man, and anyone who has attained enlightenment can be buddha. A buddha exists to teach and to point out the path of salvation. Buddha teaches people to rely on themselves and no one else. Depending on others for salvation is negative, while depending on oneself is positive. According to Buddhism, anyone can reach a state of perfection and enlightenment. The concept is far more spiritual than religious.

Copied from here
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The reading continues:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Buddha who is the founder of the Buddhist religion is called Buddha Shakyamuni “Shakya” is the name of the royal family into which he was born, and “Muni” means “Able One.” Buddha Skakyamuni was born as a royal prince in 624 BC in a place called Lumbini, which was originally in northern India but is now part of Nepal. His mother’s name was Queen Mayadevi and his father’s name was King Shuddhodana.

The Queens Dream
One night, Queen Mayadevi dreamed that a white elephant descended from heaven and entered her womb. The white elephant entering her womb indicated that on that very night she had conceived a child who was a pure and powerful being. The elephant’s descending from heaven indicated that her child came from Tu****a heaven, the Pure Land of Buddha Maitreya. Later, when she gave birth to the child, instead of experiencing pain the queen experienced a special, pure vision in which she stood holding the branch of a tree with her right hand while the gods Brahma and Indra took the child painlessly from her side. They then proceeded to honor the infant by offering him ritual ablutions.

When the king saw the child he felt as if all his wishes had been fulfilled and he named the young prince “Siddhartha.”

The Kings Delight
When the king saw the child he felt as if all his wishes had been fulfilled and he named the young prince “Siddhartha.” He invited a Brahmin seer to make predictions about the prince’s future. The seer examined the child with his clairvoyance and told the king, “There are signs that the boy could become either a chakravatin king, a ruler of the entire world, or a fully enlightened Buddha. However, since the time for chakravatin kings is now past it is certain that he will become a Buddha, and that his beneficial influence will pervade the thousand million worlds like the rays of the sun.”

Source

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[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

comps, my answer to you perfectly describes who is the Buddha- the point of Buddhism is to realize one's own self, gain your original mind. You can be the Buddha, in fact you already are the Buddha.

But yes, the first recognized historical Buddha, or the founder of Buddhism, was a Nepalese prince named Siddartha- sometimes people say he was Indian but it is a different country. Sects such as my own hold that there are literally millions of Buddhas, and many there were before Sid. You don't even have to ever have heard the name Buddha, you can be a Buddha. It depends on your understanding and your realization.

Like many before him, the circumstances of his life, such as his miracle stories, the virgin birth, etc. He has been mythicized.

Probably though, one of the most important things to know, is that he is not a God. He was a man.

[Compry]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Probably though, one of the most important things to know, is that he is not a God. He was a man. </div></div>

That's what I'm gathering from the different links that I'm reading. He was a man however according the piece below, he communicated with gods...right?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The king tried all means to prevent his son from leaving the palace. In the hope that the prince might change his mind, he surrounded him with a retinue of beautiful women, dancers, singer, and musicians, who day and night used their charms to please him; and in case the prince might attempt a secret escape he posted guards around the palace walls. However, the prince’s determination to leave the palace and enter a life of meditation could not be shaken. One night he used his miracle powers to send the guards and attendants into a deep sleep while he made his escape from the palace with the help of a trusted aide. After they had traveled about six miles, the prince dismounted from his horse and bade farewell to his aide. <span style="font-weight: bold">He then cut off his hair and threw it into the sky, where it was caught by the gods of the Land of the Thirty-three Heavens. One of the gods then offered the prince the saffron robes of a religious mendicant. The prince accepted these and gave his royal garments to the god in exchange. In this way he ordained himself as a monk.</span>

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[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some quick ones...

1) What are some of the basic Buddhist's beliefs?
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Probably you could put forward the premise that the core of Buddhism revolves around 4 Truths.

There is Suffering. Suffering has a cause. There is an end to Suffering. There is a path to end Suffering.

That is what the Buddha came to realize, and what he taught. The short of it is, that if you truly see and understand the world as it is, then you escape from the effects of suffering.

Following the 4th premise is what is called the 8 fold path. This is the basic seed upon which Buddhists seek to build their philosophy.

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2) Is the goal of Buddhism to obtain spiritual enlightenment, and if so, is this the Buddhist's equivalent of Nirvana?
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Nirvana is an interesting word. It causes a lot of confusion. It means, according to Campbell and I think he has the best handle on it, to blow out. Extinguish, snuff out, yes all these things it means, but not the way many people take it. It is like when you rob a fire of air. So to achieve Nirvana, you rob all illusory fires of their fuel. Ch'an would not make a distinction between enlightenment.

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3) What is Buddhism's perspective/teaching on suffering; i.e. its causes and its purpose, if any?
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The Buddha was very pragmatic, very observant. He saw people around him suffering. Even when he led a life of privilege, he could not escape or could not be sheltered from human suffering. The story goes he saw a sick man in t the streets, and this made him wonder at the man's condition. A lot of gobbledeegook gets morphed into it once you start getting into karma etc. Here I think it is always important to step back and recognize that 'faiths' even philosophies, are often products of their times. Buddha did not really claim to know what happened after death, but he did teach the law of Karma, and this tends to be the 'source' if you will of the why of suffering. Buddhism just sort of takes it for granted that suffering is a part of this life. In Ch'an this is taught in a famous story about the First Patriarch and his first disciple, Hui Ke. The long and short of it is that Damo came to China from India to teach Buddhism. He came to Shaolin temple, and on his journey he impressed one particular monk named Hui Ke. The manner of their meeting was this: Hui Ke was teaching the dharma in a park, and Damo was walking through the park. He caught wind of the talk and approached. As he was walking he heard the words that Hui Ke was speaking, in some cases, he nodded approval, in others, he frowned and shook his head as if to say no. Hui Ke found this to be very insulting... Before he became a monk, Hui Ke was a famous warrior, a powerful general who had slain many men. He came to see that as he had lived, so would he die. Someone was going to take him out, maybe the son or brother of someone he had slain. To atone for his evil deeds he turned to Buddhism. But he still had a fire within him, and to see this foreign barbarian nod his approval and disapproval infuriated him to the point that he couldn't take it anymore. So he snapped off a bead from his rosary and PEEEEOOOOOOOWWWWNG he snapped it at Damo with furious speed, subsequently knocking out Damo's front teeth.

For his part, Damo kept walking. Hui Ke was stunned. He felt immediate remorse and wondered why the monk did not stop, berate him, smack him, call for police or for help, anything. But for Damo to keep walking....this was completely out of his world and he decided he had to find out about this guy.

Damo never said a word to Hui Ke. Many, many years passed and Hui Ke patiently sought Damo's teachings. We're talking like, 13-14 years. Hui Ke would take care of Damo, bring him food, protect him....Damo had gone to the Shaolin temple but he did not enter therein, he kept going up to a mountain and there he found a cave and he sat there for 9 years, all the while with Hui Ke watching and entreating him to teach him.

The monks of Shaolin were also in a bind, because they didn't want anything to happen to Damo up in the mountain, they wanted him to be comfortable and safe and within the temple poper where he wouldn't be risking robbers, soldiers, bears or other wild animals who could harm him- Damo was a famous master so if anything were to happen to him, Shaolin would be the place people would look to for explanation. So they built him a special room. The implored Damo to come down and practice there, and he did. Hui Ke followed.

It was winter in the third or fourth year of being within the walls of Shaolin. There was a great snow storm. Hui Ke, something happened...his fire came back all of a sudden, I mean he had been taking care of Damo for how many years now and the guy wouldn't even deign to speak with him, and so he caught up a great heap of snow, ice, and debris, and he shoved aside Damo's door and he threw it into the special room, and he yelled at Damo, &quot;WHEN WILL YOU TEACH ME!!!!!&quot;

Damo said, &quot;When red snow falls from the sky.&quot; Now, remember, this is the first time that Damo has ever spoken to Hui Ke.

Of course, this is impossible. And if you think about it, you will start to see how many levels this little exchange really gets across.

Something inside Hui Ke changed. He took out his sword, and he lopped off his left arm. Taking up the limb, he whirled it around his head, and the blood from his severed arm froze in the air and fell to the ground as red snow.

Well, things did not get any easier for Hui Ke. Because Damo took him up into a mountain in front of Shaolin, called Drum Mountain. There, he bade Hui Ke dig a well, and to use the water of this well for a full year, to drink, to cook food, wash and bathe. Hui Ke found the water to carry a bitter flavor. At the end of this year, Hui Ke came down to the temple and bade Damo, &quot;Teach me.&quot;

Damo brought Hui Ke back up to Drum mountain, and there dug another well. He told Hui Ke, &quot;You must use the water from this well for all your needs, for the period of one year's time.&quot;

So Hui Ke did as Damo asked. He found the flavor of the water from this well to carry a distinctly spicy flavor.

Again he went to Damo after the year had ended, and again Damo brought him back up to the mountain, and dug a well. And the next year too. The water in the 3rd well was sour tasting.

While Hui Ke was up on Drum mountain during his fourth year, and using the water from the fourth well, he came to realize something- he saw that the mountain he was on, it was called Drum mountain because it was flat on top. And the water from this last well, the water was sweet. He came to understand that Damo had been teaching him, life was full of bitterness, sourness, spicyness, everything came and went like the seasons, and knowing this it made all of it sweet, and that the mountain also had a lesson, it was flat on top, but it bore all these different elements, and so Hui Ke must learn to flatten his heart.

That is also why to this day in a lot of kungfu movies you will see the Shaolin monks bow with one hand in front of their heart. We still carry this tradition, to pay respect to Hui Ke.

When you are in harmony, when you see the universe for what it is, how it is, you can bear suffering, you absorb it, like food. You take it in, you let it out.

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4) It is said that Buddhists practise Buddhism by being with Bhudda at all times in the course of their daily lives. Can you explain this?
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you are always with yourself. everything has Buddha nature, by the law of interbeing. you might not recognize Buddha, but you can't get away from it.

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5) As Buddhism neither affirm or deny the existence of a diety, have you ever wondered from where (and how) did Buddha receive his enlightenment?
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no, because the dharma is self evidentiary. there is nothing to receive, there is nothing dispensing enlightenment....you can have teachers help you on the way, or even it might come to you through sudden realization. But it comes because you understand.

[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Compray</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
That's what I'm gathering from the different links that I'm reading. He was a man however according the piece below, he communicated with gods...right?

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according to some stories, he not only communicated with some, but they learned from him. some of the parallels to other faiths are quite illustrative of just how exactly humans tend to infuse mythic themes onto the people they hold up.

[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6) In your opinion, what are some of the most misunderstood aspects of this spiritual path as perceived by people in general? </div></div>

well, there is quite a bit that is misunderstood, not just by general populace but also by Buddhists themselves.

probably though, one of the biggest is that people perceive a lot of buddhists to put Buddha on a level with say, God or Jesus.

[Nylah]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Compray</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
That's what I'm gathering from the different links that I'm reading. He was a man however according the piece below, he communicated with gods...right?

</div></div>

according to some stories, he not only communicated with some, but they learned from him. some of the parallels to other faiths are quite illustrative of just how exactly humans tend to infuse mythic themes onto the people they hold up. </div></div>

not quite following this: If Buddhism does not confirm nor deny the existence of God(s), to whom is he(Buddha) communicating?

[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

it's just differences between the various schools.

when they say they neither confirm nor deny, it is just that, as a general rule. so if people want to believe Buddha spoke with God or Gods, or that there is a God or Gods, it's cool either which way because their existence does not impact the core teachings...

Buddhism picked up a lot of local religious flavors as it travelled through Asia, for example Tibetan Buddhism has a whole pantheon of spiritual beings at work...

Also, some sects have mythologized Buddha, he has a virgin birth, a test, a lot of Jesus' mythology has a lot of paralells to Buddha.

[Nylah]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!



interesting. I didnt know that.

[Compry]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

Monk, is this guy equivalent to what Christians refer to as satan?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As dusk fell, <span style="font-weight: bold">Devaputra Mara</span>, the chief of all the demons, or maras, in this world, tried to disturb Siddhartha’s concentration by conjuring up many fearful apparitions. He manifested hosts of terrifying demons, some throwing spears, some firing arrows, some trying to burn him with fire, and some hurling boulders and even mountains at him. Through the force of his concentration, the weapons, rocks, and mountains appeared to him as a rain of fragrant flowers, and the raging fires became like offerings of rainbow lights.

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[Nylah]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<span style="font-weight: bold">That is what the Buddha came to realize, and what he taught. The short of it is, that if you truly see and understand the world as it is, then you escape from the effects of suffering.</span>

This belief I struggled with when I was younger and did some reading about Buddhism.

There is a &quot;devalution&quot; (cant think of a better word) in Buddhism regarding human emotions. Emotions are what makes us human to some extent and not all emotions, like happiness, joy, etc are undesirable.

The question is - if one finds the path to enlightenment and &quot;escapes&quot; suffering, dont you also &quot;escape&quot; all other good emotions too?

[Compry]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

I'm really digging this thread. It's refreshing learning about other beliefs.

[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Compray</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Monk, is this guy equivalent to what Christians refer to as satan?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As dusk fell, <span style="font-weight: bold">Devaputra Mara</span>, the chief of all the demons, or maras, in this world, tried to disturb Siddhartha’s concentration by conjuring up many fearful apparitions....
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<span style="font-style: italic">kind of</span>, in the sense that yes there are clearly thematic parallels between the two, especially regarding the temptations story of Buddha's enlightenment, but Mara is a little more complicated in the sense that Mara is not a rebel angel, who fell from grace into his task of being the adversary of God. I think, I'm not sure, but I think there is even a story where Mara converts and becomes a disciple of Buddha.

Mara, I think it is more accurate to say, represents Ignorance moreso than an evil agent.

But some sects certainly anthropromorphize Evil and Mara is usually the associative personality applied.

Mara is basically what is within you that keeps you from realization of the fundamental truth of things, it is that which prevents you from awakening and becoming Buddha, not really a sub deity reigning in a realm of punishment.

[rudemonk]

Re: WELCOME...*MONK*...F&amp;R Summer Feature Presentation!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nylah</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold">That is what the Buddha came to realize, and what he taught. The short of it is, that if you truly see and understand the world as it is, then you escape from the effects of suffering.</span>

This belief I struggled with when I was younger and did some reading about Buddhism.

There is a &quot;devalution&quot; (cant think of a better word) in Buddhism regarding human emotions. Emotions are what makes us human to some extent and not all emotions, like happiness, joy, etc are undesirable.

The question is - if one finds the path to enlightenment and &quot;escapes&quot; suffering, dont you also &quot;escape&quot; all other good emotions too? </div></div>

this is a common misconception and you have accurately surmised the feeling which you are left with, which is quite an unsatisfactory feeling about Buddhism. Sometimes buddhists are labelled as detached and uncaring, amoral or at least morally ambiguous. but it is not about eradicating one's emotions, it is more about understanding your emotions and their causes and conditions, why they are arising, and ruling them as opposed to them ruling you. In Ch'an, you can no more separate yourself from your emotions than you can crawl out of your own skin. when you attain enlightenment you are no longer ruled by your emotions, but this doesn't mean you no longer experience them. In fact, you are more intimately connected to them because you see their true natures. You see suffering for what it is, something which passes and comes, and hence are able to rise beyond it's grip.

or so I have been taught...