Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

[Amberal37]

A common theme in the other thread Cabinet pores over report on preliminary IMF talks regarding Jamaica and the IMF, is what has been stated by the government and others so far have all been slated as the "Wrong" policies/strategies.

Only as a question part of a rhetorical excercise...what would you suggest as an alternative?

[Amberal37]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

...I suspected not!!!

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: amberal37</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...I suspected not!!! </div></div>
<span style="font-size: 11pt">
The Answer to your question is in the archives.
It has been gone over many times for many years.
nothing has changed about the Jamaican economy other than it has responded as i expected .

Nothing will change even after this IMF involvement.
since there is no interest to make the sort of changes that are required to achieve the result we are looking for.
You see the real government of Jamaica a are satisfied with th

e way thing are. They have no intrest in any changes that will threaten their grip0n on the economy.

They are satisfied to select ther politicians and have them take blame.
The problem is that the politicians know that they will go the way of the Hgonduran president with the blessing of their BIG UNCLE. </span>

[Wahalla]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

lower income tax... increase the tax base... primarily....reduce interest rates to the point that it is work investing rather than buying govermetn sjotr term bonds....increase teh jamaican content of tourism product, reduce the jamaica content of food imports, by encouraging more home productions, one carrot less imported attitude, move to introduce itnermidiate skills into agriculture,acess to reasonable credit, some reform of agriculture (including skill dvelopment in hydrogony,ect)... the macro stuff is beyond me... And nuking kingston....

But the best thing is all non Tainos to leave and go back to which ever contienet they identify with....

[johnnycakes]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy

Amberal,
It does not matter if the government borrows money from the IMF or not.
Nothing will change except for the rising debt level.
The money will be urinated away, wasted on projects that never pan out because Jamaica is a POOR, HEAVILY INDEBTED, UNDERDEVELOPED THIRD WORLD (meaning few or no exploitable resources) COUNTRY.

It is addicted to the form of capitalism that does not and cannot work in a country like Jamaica. Anytime you have a country that is already poor and there may be just barely enough wealth in the country to ensure a decent standard of living or high human development for every person and then you install an economic system where a far disproportionate share of that scarece wealth goes to a relative handful at the top, you guarantee a huge level of poverty at the bottom.
Indeed about half the world's population with the same economic systems as Jamaica barely survives on $1-2 dollars a day while there are lots of millionaires in those same countries..


Capitalism guarantees about 25% poverty as it is in the richest of capitalist countries, the United States or up to 80% as it is in many of the poorest nations.

It cannot be reformed and it corrupts both the society and the government officials because in a system where money is God, it becomes not an important thing but the only THING that matters and the thing that comes before all other things, like the Golden Rule, humaneness, a decent place to live; that sort of rubbish.

Democracy in place of a (non) representative government whose representatives are given to us to vote for by a small group of party politicians who decide who will be a candidate and who will not, would be a good start.

But that would mean letting go of the traditional apathy and lack of participation in the electoral and political process at a meaningful level.

People would have to pay attention and provide input to any democratic way of choosing candidates instead of waiting to see who the PNP and the JLP ALLOW them to vote for.

Jamaicans are far too insular, too parochial to try anything new, anything different from the devil they know and so Jamaica will continue to sink economically and socially.

Things will have to get a lot worse just to get the Jamaican people out roadblocking and burning tyres.

Any serious change in the economy or the (non-democratic) electoral system would/could only follow a series of national catastrophes

[RichD]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wahalla</div><div class="ubbcode-body">lower income tax... increase the tax base... </div></div>tax compliace is a huge issue in jamaica...last i heard the rate was in the 30% range

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wahalla</div><div class="ubbcode-body">lower income tax... increase the tax base... </div></div>tax compliance is a huge issue in Jamaica...last i heard the rate was in the 30% range </div></div>What is your best suggestion, not just Rich,anybody, to motivate the people to, the small business people to pay taxes. Since ther is no way unless you are going to ban the use of cash to get the compliance rate up to workable level???

[RichD]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

its not just small business ..many large companies are not paying their taxes.

not sure how you movtivate them ...the big stick hasnt really worked..alot of it come back to the attitude that the laws are for others i don't need to comply.

[remo]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wahalla</div><div class="ubbcode-body">lower income tax... increase the tax base... </div></div>tax compliace is a huge issue in jamaica...last i heard the rate was in the 30% range </div></div>

30% that's nuts,Dat have to change or else the country will not move forward....

[johnnycakes]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy

Were Jamaica to collect all the taxes due, it would not make much difference in the failed (capitalist) economy it is handcuffed to.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: johnnycakes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Were Jamaica to collect all the taxes due, it would not make much difference in the failed (capitalist) economy it is handcuffed to. </div></div> Iy make a big duifference. Jamaica is not even collecting 1% of the land tax potential. What will happen as you increase the property taxes, is the owners will make sure they are productiuve eonogh to pay the taxes, or tghey will sell it to those who are able to make it productive. Property taxes is a big problem

[RichD]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: johnnycakes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Were Jamaica to collect all the taxes due, it would not make much difference in the failed (capitalist) economy it is handcuffed to. </div></div> Iy make a big duifference. Jamaica is not even collecting 1% of the land tax potential. What will happen as you increase the property taxes, is the owners will make sure they are productiuve eonogh to pay the taxes, or tghey will sell it to those who are able to make it productive. Property taxes is a big problem </div></div> property taxes are a very punitive tax...any significant increase in property taxes such as you seem to be recommending will result in the further concentration of property ownership in the hands of the few who will be able to afford it.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy


<span style="font-size: 11pt">No Rich it will not.
property has collateral value.
property has productive capacity.
Property in the hands of people who are not willing or capable of utilizing it for that purpose is totally against the meaning of economics.
Economics is the process of the utilization of all factors to achieve the highest economic <span style="font-weight: bold">and socially responsible </span>return.

ther are many ways in which this could be done.
But first certain essential necessities should be in place. The most important one is that instead of exporting the Jamaican fresh water,(selling it to cruise liners by the ton), it should be redirected to create a national irrigation system.
Then lands will be much more valuable since it could <span style="font-weight: bold">reliably</span> produce economic crops..

those who are not capable of utilizing lands for this purpose, should not be in control of it, unless they are willing to lease it for the purpose. The land is the country.
If the country is to grow, the land has to be as productive as it possibly can. </span>

[RichD]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy

is thei just farm land you are talking about?


would you propose some exemption for residential property?

in the last round of market value assement before the adjustmens were made i know of peopel who were facing property tax i goign from $1,700 a year to $360,000 per year. in many cases there were person on fixed incomes whow might havebeen forced out of there homes by this increas.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Suggestions for the government, on how to handle economy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">is thei just farm land you are talking about?


would you propose some exemption for residential property?

in the last round of market value assement before the adjustmens were made i know of peopel who were facing property tax i goign from $1,700 a year to $360,000 per year. in many cases there were person on fixed incomes whow might havebeen forced out of there homes by this increas. </div></div> No, all forms of property. even beach front properties. Jamaica does not have enough boat moorings, for instance.
Places that are too dep and nit suiyable fir beaches, could be transformed into boat moorings. That is one aspect of tourism that locals could get onto. Own the boats and hire them out ton fishing trips etc.
Jamaica does not have enough villas fro rental . thes could be placed on many existing properties and increase the earning capacity fo the properties. the sis so much that could be done of the infrastructure was in place.360,000 per year is less than US 4000 a year I pay more thna thatfor non productive propeerty per month.