Did Jesus really exist?

[Mutty]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David_Mullings</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My answer to this question i simple:

Why does it matter?

If you find a note right now that says that some guy named David, wrote in 1847 saying that if humans were to treat each other kindly and the World would be better, would it matter if you couldn't find this person?

The <span style="font-weight: bold">man</span> is not nearly important as the <span style="font-weight: bold">message</span>.

The proper question is whether or not the teachings of Jesus are true.

I for one believe that it is true that &quot;do unto others as you would have them do unto you&quot; would lead to a more harmonious World.

It matters not if Jesus was real. </div></div>

Others said that he said that folks who did not heed his word and believe IN him would be cast into fire too. I think for quite a few folks, this might matter to them. Also without him existing for real, you would not have some people trying to control what others do based on some fear that he is coming back to kick [censored]. Te belief that he exists is as important to many as the devil's existence is. Without either, some things just can't work.

[rudemonk]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mutty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David_Mullings</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My answer to this question i simple:

Why does it matter?

If you find a note right now that says that some guy named David, wrote in 1847 saying that if humans were to treat each other kindly and the World would be better, would it matter if you couldn't find this person?

The <span style="font-weight: bold">man</span> is not nearly important as the <span style="font-weight: bold">message</span>.

The proper question is whether or not the teachings of Jesus are true.

I for one believe that it is true that &quot;do unto others as you would have them do unto you&quot; would lead to a more harmonious World.

It matters not if Jesus was real. </div></div>

Others said that he said that folks who did not heed his word and believe IN him would be cast into fire too. I think for quite a few folks, this might matter to them. Also without him existing for real, you would not have some people trying to control what others do based on some fear that he is coming back to kick [censored]. Te belief that he exists is as important to many as the devil's existence is. Without either, some things just can't work. </div></div>
which point is to me, the clearest evidence that the NT contains extracurricular material, because you can't say/teach one thing, then the next minute say something contrary.

The biggest thing is, we don't have a book from Yashua, we have books about him. There is a huge difference. The only thing we have any documentation on that he wrote, nobody even knows what it said and he wrote it in the dirt.

I always found that to be interesting and if we are to accept many Christians POV, it is a curiousity to me that God's own Son sent to save us from Sin- which we now know for an unequivocal fact couldn't have happened as depicted in the Bible- so that never really happened but anyway, the very Son of God with our roadmap to Eternal Salvation couldn't have been bothered to write it down for us? Moses wrote, according to tradition. God wrote on the tablets. Prophets, they all wrote. So why didn't Yashua, thereby leaving no chance in hell for there to be any possible confusion for some poor innocent to get tossed to the fire to spite their ignorance.

One of the first big questions I asked my local priest, which made him look at me like I slapped his mother with a wet fish, was when in the Garden of Eden, why didn't God step in and stop the Serpent from hurting Eve. I was immediately reminded of my next door neighbor, who liked to burn ants with a magnifying glass and blow up toads with firecrackers.

[f0rTyLeGz]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Some of the stuff wasn't unprededented at all, and the name &quot;Jesus&quot; wasn't unique. People were casting out demons and doing healings well before Jesus' time, and that continued afterwards. Heck, there could be one in some country of the world right now that we know absolutely nothing about. Not unlike other writings from the Ancient Near East, some of the Biblical language is hyperbolic. A sentence like the one quoted above is relative to Jesus' sorroundings. It doesn't mean at the time that it went further than his sorrounding neighbourhood as evidenced in the last two words &quot;around Galilee&quot;. </div></div>
I've thought about your post here a dozen times today CEW... I see now Mutty thinks pretty much as I do.

Belief in Jesus' miracles is the core of Christianity, imo, yet you believe that other people could cast out demons in Jesus' day, and that &quot;there could be one in some country of the world right now that we know absolutely nothing about (performing miracles like Jesus did.)&quot; And we know nothing about it? Hunh?! I;m shocked! Even the Bible stories have Jesus trying to prevent people from talking about his miracles, because the writers knew how word would spread if someone ACTUALLY raised the dead, or healed lepers, or blind people.

Imagination...

Imagine that you could heal by touching a sick person CEW... what would you do? Would you spend every waking minutes running through hospitals touching the sick and dying?

When I was growing up my mother was a big believer in miracles, and longing for their manifestation was a constant daily pressure. I've never heard of one miracle, or one manifestation of the power of prayer... it just doesn't happen. The NYTimes would cover it. It would be real... in the news... everywhere.

But <span style="font-style: italic">imagine</span> this... you live in a small village of 500 people. This is back 2000 years ago. You have no idea how big the world really is. There are stories, but nobody really knows. Someone in your village starts healing people by just touching them. He heals the blind and they can see. He raises people from the dead. Do you think word would get out?

[Wahalla]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I've never heard of one miracle</div></div>

Yes you have.. when you have seen your children smile at learning a new skill.. when you have tasted the un restrained pleasure of a fresh fruit, a moment in front of a picture who's acestic value has left you breathless....A hand ful of dirt, a leaf..the uliterian perfection of a DNA/ RNA strand. Miracles are common place... <span style="font-weight: bold">Miracles are unapriciated un dramatic every day simple things </span>.. Listen to a Pavoroti or the smell of roasting coffee in the morning.. an amoeba... look at your hand it is a miracle at functionality.... even death is a miracle.. our built in obselence over time.. our ability to adpat from the pole to the equator.. the curve of a womans butt, the electricity of her touch.. the magic of lust, the madness of broken promise.. our ability to learn.. a smile ... our heart yep that pump that lasts for so long and pulses blood...

My favorite miracle is the John Crow.. I miss them... I spent hours in my youth at them with envy. They are a miracle how can such an ugly bird be so beautiful ?????

Raising the dead, curing sickness at a touch that is blase.. reactive events to perserived tragedies.. but the cause of leposry that is the miracle.. the maleria parasite.. these are proactive miracles....

<span style="font-weight: bold">the belief in any invisible god belittles men and nature.. </span>and underminds the miracles... god is death if you have to die to know him.. subscribing to it is thus an anti miracle life is a miracle.. it is just not appriciated....

[H_O]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mutty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David_Mullings</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My answer to this question i simple:

Why does it matter?

If you find a note right now that says that some guy named David, wrote in 1847 saying that if humans were to treat each other kindly and the World would be better, would it matter if you couldn't find this person?

The <span style="font-weight: bold">man</span> is not nearly important as the <span style="font-weight: bold">message</span>.

The proper question is whether or not the teachings of Jesus are true.

I for one believe that it is true that &quot;do unto others as you would have them do unto you&quot; would lead to a more harmonious World.

It matters not if Jesus was real. </div></div>

Others said that he said that folks who did not heed his word and believe IN him would be cast into fire too. I think for quite a few folks, this might matter to them. Also without him existing for real, you would not have some people trying to control what others do based on some fear that he is coming back to kick [censored]. Te belief that he exists is as important to many as the devil's existence is. Without either, some things just can't work. </div></div>

Mutty- your LAST statement is one of the oldest fears ingrained in humanity.
Light and Dark, Good and Evil

the Religious institution uses fear as a method of teaching

[H_O]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

We are many generations removed from the bible. How can we know the truth about the bible when it was in the hands of men that secretly dwelled behind church walls while the masses were illiterate and could not see changes in the text? God never speaks for himself yet there are no shortage of men willing to speak on Gods's behalf. This should be your first clue about the authenticity of the so called word of God. The word of God does not exist but the indoctrinated can not see this fact.

[j-can]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David_Mullings</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My answer to this question i simple:

Why does it matter?

If you find a note right now that says that some guy named David, wrote in 1847 saying that if humans were to treat each other kindly and the World would be better, would it matter if you couldn't find this person?

The <span style="font-weight: bold">man</span> is not nearly important as the <span style="font-weight: bold">message</span>.

The proper question is whether or not the teachings of Jesus are true.

I for one believe that it is true that &quot;do unto others as you would have them do unto you&quot; would lead to a more harmonious World.

It matters not if Jesus was real. </div></div>



If Jesus wasn't real and just a figment of somebody's imigination,Wouldn't that be a fatal blow to christianity as we know it?

[H_O]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: j-can</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David_Mullings</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My answer to this question i simple:

Why does it matter?

If you find a note right now that says that some guy named David, wrote in 1847 saying that if humans were to treat each other kindly and the World would be better, would it matter if you couldn't find this person?

The <span style="font-weight: bold">man</span> is not nearly important as the <span style="font-weight: bold">message</span>.

The proper question is whether or not the teachings of Jesus are true.

I for one believe that it is true that &quot;do unto others as you would have them do unto you&quot; would lead to a more harmonious World.

It matters not if Jesus was real. </div></div>



If Jesus wasn't real and just a figment of somebody's imigination,Wouldn't that be a fatal blow to christianity as we know it?
</div></div>tell that to 200 million people in the United States.
christianity is a Roman Story.

the Vatican been hiding lots of secrets for centuries
it could never come out because that would be a blow to there tax-free corporation.

[dahjah]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

it's no secret, it is written bout in all de councils, from nicea to ephesus, it is even written bout in de bible dat de whole ting a jus mek up story. But de programming is sooo strong it hawd fi get de world to see reality. Tell de muslims dat muhammad nevah exhist eedah cah dat a de nex truth.

[H_O]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Emperah_dahJah</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it's no secret, it is written bout in all de councils, from nicea to ephesus, it is even written bout in de bible dat de whole ting a jus mek up story. But de programming is sooo strong it hawd fi get de world to see reality. Tell de muslims dat muhammad nevah exhist eedah cah dat a de nex truth. </div></div>
sometimes whe yu seh get to mi--but mi respek yuh doa.

yeah--tell the Muslims that..
tell them when there worshipping Mohammed there actually just worshipping the Middle Eastern Government who made up that foolishness thousands of years ago

[Mutty]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

J-Can, you're not interested in answering my questions in post #852862 on page 2?

[Diplomat]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: j-can</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[If Jesus wasn't real and just a figment of somebody's imigination,Wouldn't that be a fatal blow to christianity as we know it?
</div></div>
Of course it would be, but because He is, it is a moot point!

[David Mullings]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: j-can</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David_Mullings</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My answer to this question i simple:

Why does it matter?

If you find a note right now that says that some guy named David, wrote in 1847 saying that if humans were to treat each other kindly and the World would be better, would it matter if you couldn't find this person?

The <span style="font-weight: bold">man</span> is not nearly important as the <span style="font-weight: bold">message</span>.

The proper question is whether or not the teachings of Jesus are true.

I for one believe that it is true that &quot;do unto others as you would have them do unto you&quot; would lead to a more harmonious World.

It matters not if Jesus was real. </div></div>



If Jesus wasn't real and just a figment of somebody's imigination,Wouldn't that be a fatal blow to christianity as we know it?
</div></div>

The fatal blow to Christianity is the history of Christianity itself and the proof that the books in the Bible were chosen by men to serve their own selfish purposes, books were not written by who claimed to write them and the Bible is filled with contradictions.

The &quot;Christianity&quot; of Europeans is dead, they just fail to acknowledge that.

The &quot;Christianity&quot; where people actually follow the teachings of Jesus Christ, not a bunch of other contradicting books, is alive and will take its rightful place.

p.s. I am not a Christian of either sort, just someone who agrees with the teachings attributed to Christ.

I don't like &quot;Religions&quot; as they are tools of control. I like &quot;Philosophies&quot; because they can't be corrupted.

[j-can]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mutty</div><div class="ubbcode-body">J-Can, I'm curious. What brought all of this about? What led up to it? You don't have to derail this thread to explain and can start another one or since it is yours, you can. </div></div>


I had allways questioned whether Jesus did all those things that was attributed to him but never once did I question his existence.

Until ironically I read a letter in the Gleaner on line which lead me to a documentary called Zeitgeist the movie peaked my interest so I did some more research (2 days after work at the library and on line)Maybe I got a little too emotional but I felt I was misled all these years

You have to understand I am not suddenly an atheist but my eyes are now opened..So to speak

[Mutty]

Re: Did Jesus really exist?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: j-can</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mutty</div><div class="ubbcode-body">J-Can, I'm curious. What brought all of this about? What led up to it? You don't have to derail this thread to explain and can start another one or since it is yours, you can. </div></div>


I had allways questioned whether Jesus did all those things that was attributed to him but never once did I question his existence.

Until ironically I read a letter in the Gleaner on line which lead me to a documentary called Zeitgeist the movie peaked my interest so I did some more research (2 days after work at the library and on line)Maybe I got a little too emotional but I felt I was misled all these years

You have to understand I am not suddenly an atheist but my eyes are now opened..So to speak </div></div>

Gotcha! I understand where you're at.