How Much Faith Is Enough?

[Diplomat]

I had a conversation with someone yesterday who made mention of praying for more faith. I have heard this on more than one occasion from various people, and I thought this was one prayer that might not get answered seeing those people would have to have faith to believe God that they already had all the faith they needed! What is your take on this?

[coffeegyal]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

I can sort of understand...maybe someone has faith (i.e., belief in God), but the person feels that s/he it's not normal to have doubts creep in. So s/he prays for more faith, thinking that's the way around doubt and questions.

Or, am I coming at this too superficially?

[Guest]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

My best friend told me that this is all I need:

Matthew 17:20b  If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

So just a little tiny bit. The tricky part is exercising the little tiny bit that we have.

[Queen]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

I think the prayer should be directed more on the grace & wisdom to activate the faith and the strength and courage to build on it once activated.

Faith is like a muscle, the more you work at developing it, the stronger it becomes. If left alone it becomes saggy and thin and seemingly non-existent even though it's there, lying beneath the skin / fatty tissue.

[Diplomat]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by coffeegyal:
[qb] I can sort of understand...maybe someone has faith (i.e., belief in God), but the person feels that s/he it's not normal to have doubts creep in. So s/he prays for more faith, thinking that's the way around doubt and questions.

Or, am I coming at this too superficially? [/qb]

Not at all, as I do think that point of view is correct in some cases.

[Diplomat]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by Queen:
I think the prayer should be directed more on the grace & wisdom to activate the faith and the strength and courage to build on it once activated.

Do you care to expand on this?

Faith is like a muscle, the more you work at developing it, the stronger it becomes. If left alone it becomes saggy and thin and seemingly non-existent even though it's there, lying beneath the skin / fatty tissue.

I like the analogy, but to further provoke your thinking, how does one start to exercise the faith they already have? Is it a matter of just deciding to do it regardless of what circumstances says? As Compry rightly stated: "The tricky part is exercising the little tiny bit that we have."

[Dailybread]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by CEW:
[qb] I had a conversation with someone yesterday who made mention of praying for more faith. I have heard this on more than one occasion from various people, and I thought this was one prayer that might not get answered seeing those people would have to have faith to believe God that they already had all the faith they needed! What is your take on this? [/qb]

It's not a matter of having more faith but instead excercising the faith that one has. We all have faith in different things. We need to focus our faith on God and not so much on our jobs, cars, husbands, wives, children etc. When those things fail we then say oh I need more faith. It's the same faith that you now place into something or someone else. Why not just have faith in God?

[Dailybread]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by Compry:
[qb] My best friend told me that this is all I need:

Matthew 17:20b  If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

So just a little tiny bit. The tricky part is exercising the little tiny bit that we have. [/qb]

I heard this song recently:
Just a little bit of faith faith faith
Just a little bit of faith faith faith
you don't need a whole lot
just use what you've got
just a little bit of faith faith faith

* we need to use what we have before asking for more*

[Queen]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Will expand later....out to lunch.

[Diplomat]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by Dailybread:
It's not a matter of having more faith but instead excercising the faith that one has. We all have faith in different things. We need to focus our faith on God and not so much on our jobs, cars, husbands, wives, children etc. When those things fail we then say oh I need more faith. It's the same faith that you now place into something or someone else. Why not just have faith in God?

But if it is that easy, why are so many people struggling with it? Could it be that it is not that simple or is the problem our mindset? Just some thought provoking questions [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[coffeegyal]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

I tend to put faith in things or people that have stood by me in the past. I base faith on track records or on documentation (like reading about cars before buying one, and talking to others who have the type I'm considering).

So, how does one "refocus" one's faith in family, friends and objects (like cars) and just switch over to God like Dailybread seems to be suggesting? I guess faith is bigger than "reliance"? I don't know...this is one of my difficulties with religions that require faith in the unseen. How can I understand the track record, how can I know what to expect?

[Diplomat]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by coffeegyal:
[qb] I tend to put faith in things or people that have stood by me in the past. I base faith on track records or on documentation (like reading about cars before buying one, and talking to others who have the type I'm considering).

So, how does one "refocus" one's faith in family, friends and objects (like cars) and just switch over to God like Dailybread seems to be suggesting? I guess faith is bigger than "reliance"? I don't know...this is one of my difficulties with religions that require faith in the unseen. How can I understand the track record, how can I know what to expect? [/qb]

Faith in family/people and things is not quite as dissimilar to faith in God as we would like to think. The biggest difference however is that with the former there is a certain degree of control, while in the latter, there is no human control, so to speak. In Christian doctrine, we understand that "faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.", and for the believer that means believing that the thing we pray for - assuming we are praying in God's will - will be given to us.

Where faith is most exercised in God is by people who have had a "track record" with Him. We *know* He is going to come through, moreso than we know that Aunt Mary or Uncle Joe will. The person lacking in faith turns it the other way around; they are somewhat sure of Uncle Joe and Aunt Mary but not quite so sure about God.

[Queen]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by CEW:
[qb]

Originally posted by Queen:
I think the prayer should be directed more on the grace & wisdom to activate the faith and the strength and courage to build on it once activated.

Do you care to expand on this?[/qb]

It's simple, since we all have a measure of faith, the prayer then, should consist of asking God to show us how to use what's already there. How to go about exercising this faith, the favour (grace) to do so in a wise manner. Once we start to see faith in action, our confidence level in God and our faith rises and the exercise becomes less complicated in our minds.

[qb]Faith is like a muscle, the more you work at developing it, the stronger it becomes. If left alone it becomes saggy and thin and seemingly non-existent even though it's there, lying beneath the skin / fatty tissue.

I like the analogy, but to further provoke your thinking, how does one start to exercise the faith they already have? Is it a matter of just deciding to do it regardless of what circumstances says? As Compry rightly stated: "The tricky part is exercising the little tiny bit that we have." [/qb]

Sometimes exercising faith means doing so regardless of what circumstances says; a part of the definition of faith is "faith is the evidence of things not seen." This does not take into consideration the present circumstance. One may risk being labelled "crazy" in an effort to exercise or stand on faith in God. Circumstances may say save the little you have and you'll have more. God's word says "give and it shall be given to you bountifully" Faith is standing and acting upon God's word.

Take, for example, the story of Abraham & Isaac. Abraham went against the ordinary, I'm sure he didn't tell his wife what he planned on doing to their son per the instructions of God. He heard from God and decided to stand on his faith and God's worth regardless of the circumstance. A big variable in exercising faithc we could conclude then, is knowing God's word and his will.

[Dailybread]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by CEW:
[qb]

Originally posted by Dailybread:
It's not a matter of having more faith but instead excercising the faith that one has. We all have faith in different things. We need to focus our faith on God and not so much on our jobs, cars, husbands, wives, children etc. When those things fail we then say oh I need more faith. It's the same faith that you now place into something or someone else. Why not just have faith in God?

But if it is that easy, why are so many people struggling with it? Could it be that it is not that simple or is the problem our mindset? Just some thought provoking questions [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [/qb]

Thought provoking indeed [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I do believe that it is that simple which is why we are struggling with it. People tend to gravitate to what they can see and touch. Because I can see my mother it's easy to accept the fact that she's there and can do for me. Because I can't see God though I know He's there it becomes harder to depend on him. We need to look at faith through our spiritual eyes and not our physical eyes. It's the same reason so many people have problems believing God because they can't see him and all He ask is that you believe on Him. Very deep and interesting topic!

[Dailybread]

Re: How Much Faith Is Enough?

Originally posted by coffeegyal:
[qb] I tend to put faith in things or people that have stood by me in the past. I base faith on track records or on documentation (like reading about cars before buying one, and talking to others who have the type I'm considering).

So, how does one "refocus" one's faith in family, friends and objects (like cars) and just switch over to God like Dailybread seems to be suggesting? I guess faith is bigger than "reliance"? I don't know...this is one of my difficulties with religions that require faith in the unseen. How can I understand the track record, how can I know what to expect? [/qb]

If you can see it and touch it then there's no need to have faith. Faith is basically having complete trust and confidence in something or someone. If you see a chair with four legs chances you're not going to question whether or not it can hold you up so you just sit on it. If you see one with three you may not just sit on it because you have a doubt in your mind that it can hold you up with that missing leg.

You depend on people based on their track record it's the same way you should have faith in God and build a track record with him. Prove him.