Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

[Dr.Dudd]

Bus robbers killed
Wednesday, 24 September 2008
Two of seven gunmen who attempted to rob a public passenger bus along Slipe Road in Kingston were fatally shot Wednesday morning.

The identities of the men have not yet been released.

It's reported that shortly after nine o'clock seven men boarded an NTCS bus which plies the Lawrence Tavern to Downtown route at Torrington Bridge.

While the bus was travelling along Slipe Road, the men pulled guns and began robbing the passengers.

However, a passenger who was a licensed firearm holder surprised the men when he pulled his weapon and opened fire on them. Two of them were hit.

One of the men died in the bus, while the others escaped.

Terrified passengers jumped through windows to escape injury during the gunfight.

The police reported that the cronies of the wounded men retrieved their weapons while making their escape.

None of the passengers was injured.

The West Kingston Police have launched a manhunt for the other suspects.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

The only reason why the crime rate is so high in Jamaica is simply because it's black Jamaicans that are dyung.
The majototy of Jamaiuvcans of other races have licensed firearms. As a resuot the cowardly criminals avoud them. They prey on the only group that the government cinspores to destroy by it's ploocy of placing a too gigh premium on carrying cash.
of blacks were as likely to be armed as whoites ond other races,the incidences of armed robberies would be much lower,and th emurder rats as well. Yet succevive giovernments hav eharmed the black dem9graophy by placing less value in their quality of life and right to live without beliw that of other races.They shiuld start a mivement to mibilize the people to demand the right to carry forearms,and if they are not allowed to do si,they should aquire guns in such great numbers that ut becomes impossible to disarm them. That is what theye may have to do.
uncidentally firearms are easily manufactired and so is ammo. All People have the right to protect themselves police does noy offer protection,the only true protection from crime and violence us <span style="font-weight: bold">deterrent</span> asnd no nimber of police officers can create that deterent while they are absent. It is a fraud to ask people to expect th epolioce to protect themand it is a fallacy to propose that increrasing th enumber of officers will reduce crimeand violence to a tollerable rate. They take black Jamaicans for fools, because for th emost part, they behave like fools, ...especially the educated ones.

What a waste of goof educational opportunitirs.
shuc ....

[Sofisa]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

Awww Doc. I presented some of these arguments to some resident Jamaicans, and it was interesting and hilarious to hear some reasons why these black ppl did not think it would be a good idea. From endless shootings, to the need for more prayer.

I would say that if the ppl can't see the need, then they wont make demands, and the govt does nothing about it. Seems they are quite content to live off the promises of politicians.

[Blackstar*]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-style: italic">Terrified passengers jumped through windows to escape injury during the gunfight.</span> </div></div>
Fortunately no innocent bystanders were hit in the crossfire. It's one thing to have a permit to own a gun, but quite another to be trained on how to use it <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-size: 11pt">in a crowd </span></span>as opposed to hitting an immobile target on a shooting range.

[Sofisa]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BlackStar</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-style: italic">Terrified passengers jumped through windows to escape injury during the gunfight.</span> </div></div>
Fortunately no innocent bystanders were hit in the crossfire. It's one thing to have a permit to own a gun, but quite another to be trained on how to use it <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-size: 11pt">in a crowd </span></span>as opposed to hitting an immobile target on a shooting range. </div></div>

Fortunately the armed citizen was not hurt. Unforunately, the passengers prolly see him as putting their lives in danger. Do you know of any training offered to civilians on how to use a gun in a crowd?

[Blackstar*]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sofisa</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-style: italic">Fortunately the armed citizen was not hurt. Unforunately, the passengers prolly see him as putting their lives in danger. <span style="font-weight: bold">Do you know of any training offered to civilians on how to use a gun in a crowd?</span></span> </div></div>
If people are to bear arms as a deterrent to crime as Dr. Dudd has been recommending, they should most certainly be trained on how to use it in all situations. A firearm in and of itself offers no protection against crime unless the bearer knows how to use it in every type of potentially dangerous situations.

[remo]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

so just being a licensed gun holder in jamaica gives you the right to open up fire in a crowded bus....I understand if you are in your house,but on public transport?

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">so just being a licensed gun holder in jamaica gives you the right to open up fire in a crowded bus....I understand if you are in your house,but on public transport? </div></div> Well understand this in any jurisdiction where you have a right to carry a firearm,you have the right to kill any person that use one to attack you.
And using a gun to hold people ransome,is kidnapping, and in any case of kidnapping the victim have a right to even kill the kidnapper to escape.
.....Even in a public bus.
Why have a gun if even when you are inder emminent attack, you don't hav ethe right to ise it decicively??

Meaninfg to shoot to kill, that is what decicively mean in that context.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BlackStar</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sofisa</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-style: italic">Fortunately the armed citizen was not hurt. Unforunately, the passengers prolly see him as putting their lives in danger. <span style="font-weight: bold">Do you know of any training offered to civilians on how to use a gun in a crowd?</span></span> </div></div>
If people are to bear arms as a deterrent to crime as Dr. Dudd has been recommending, they should most certainly be trained on how to use it in all situations. A firearm in and of itself offers no protection against crime unless the bearer knows how to use it in every type of potentially dangerous situations. </div></div> believe it or not that is why they have Gun clibs in Jamaica. <span style="text-decoration: line-through"> You can't strike that.</span> You are not suppose tpo be issued a permit until you nave presented certificate of competence.
And you can't be trained fpr 'all' circimstances. some will be one of a kind, but the type incident bus one is a regular.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BlackStar</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sofisa</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-style: italic">Fortunately the armed citizen was not hurt. Unforunately, the passengers prolly see him as putting their lives in danger. <span style="font-weight: bold">Do you know of any training offered to civilians on how to use a gun in a crowd?</span></span> </div></div>
If people are to bear arms as a deterrent to crime as Dr. Dudd has been recommending, they should most certainly be trained on how to use it in all situations. A firearm in and of itself offers no protection against crime unless the bearer knows how to use it in every type of potentially dangerous situations. </div></div> Detereent only reffers to detering whe whole iuncident. That means when criminals realize that lots of black people carry licenced guns,and are qulling to kill an armed attacker,it creates a situation where the criminal has to choose between risking their life every time they attempt crime against people who are most like armed with a gun.
Thaty is whathappen in safe societies. But that took the action of the ecucated in thise societies, to bring pressure on government to do that. The dofference is that Our educated are not that educated to realize that

[remo]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">so just being a licensed gun holder in jamaica gives you the right to open up fire in a crowded bus....I understand if you are in your house,but on public transport? </div></div> Well understand this in any jurisdiction where you have a right to carry a firearm,you have the right to kill any person that use one to attack you.
And using a gun to hold people ransome,is kidnapping, and in any case of kidnapping the victim have a right to even kill the kidnapper to escape.
.....Even in a public bus.
Why have a gun if even when you are inder emminent attack, you don't hav ethe right to ise it decicively??

Meaninfg to shoot to kill, that is what decicively mean in that context. </div></div>


And here I am thinking this is the 21's century

[Morpheous]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">so just being a licensed gun holder in jamaica gives you the right to open up fire in a crowded bus....I understand if you are in your house,but on public transport? </div></div>
Doc will disagree with you because from you own a license firearm you can open up in crowd or no crowd if you feel you under threat. I find that some what irresponsible and it sound like the victims were more terrified of the licensed gunman reaction rather the the unlicensed gunmen actions. Defend yourself yes but responsibly otherwise we must agree with politicians when they say it is acceptable to have innocent lives lost during a police raid, country invasion etc. Unlike the unlicensed gunmen... responsibility comes with owning a licensed gun.

[johnnycakes]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

Adding lots more guns to an already out-of-control violent society is no different than pouring gasoline on a fire.

Doc, you have to be nuts.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: johnnycakes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Adding lots more guns to an already out-of-control violent society is no different than pouring gasoline on a fire.

Doc, you have to be nuts. </div></div> Do you know what is used to put out a oilfield well head fire??

you probably do not realize that ie is dynamite.

I can see that you are again attempting to use commonsence to solve a problem that requires social science.
According to your commensense based argument, using dynamite would have been more destructive. Well that is what is used today.

Another example of seemingly iligocal effect is when arms is used to against thugs to regain civility.
I that is what is reserved for armed forces, but thes forces are not made up of the same citizens. I suppose it is alright for white people.
Nnot black people though ,they are not civilized enough, to be trusted to use whatever means to safeguard themselves.

They need to be supervised with technologically advance machinery as <span style="text-decoration: line-through">intercontinental balistic missiles</span> I mean hand guns.
Yes hand guns in th ehands of black people, will destroy the Jamaican sense of safety. Probably destroy themselves according to your analogy.
Let us think for those people, or better yet let us protect them from themselves.
We are their benevolent masters.

Sorry I am one of them, so thanks for the past centuries of protection and thanks in advance for the future protection.......

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Bus robbers killed by armed citizen

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: More4us</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: remo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">so just being a licensed gun holder in jamaica gives you the right to open up fire in a crowded bus....I understand if you are in your house,but on public transport? </div></div>
Doc will disagree with you because from you own a license firearm you can open up in crowd or no crowd if you feel you under threat. I find that some what irresponsible and it sound like the victims were more terrified of the licensed gunman reaction rather the the unlicensed gunmen actions. Defend yourself yes but responsibly otherwise we must agree with politicians when they say it is acceptable to have innocent lives lost during a police raid, country invasion etc. Unlike the unlicensed gunmen... responsibility comes with owning a licensed gun. </div></div> Speak for yourself.
This is how a logical argument is derailed by frivalous innuendos, that has no place in serious discussions.

Please remind the readers of the instance or number of instances,wher I have suggested, or even hinted that &quot;<span style="font-weight: bold">from you own a license firearm you can open up in crowd or no crowd if you feel you under threat</span>&quot;?

Please don't limit your answer to my discussion in this post, on this board, or any specific media.

Thanks in advance.