Cosby: I'm Just Curious

[Tropicana]

Rumor has it during the Civil Rights Movement Blll was at the Playboy Mansion trying to do you know what with all those bunnies....which is probable where he pick up or honed his predilections.

I agree. Any man who hangs out at the Playboy Mansion is a dawgasaurus of the highest order.

I revisted this low point when he took it upon himself to berate poor black men in the public media

Fi di las' time, he did not berate poor black men in public he spoke THE TRUTH!!

Why are we SO afraid to speak the truth about the rampant irresponsibility of many men in the Jamaican and African American community. What are we afraid of. Don't want yt to know....trust me dem know LONG time as they are the ones who started it.

[franksterr]

Fi di las' time, he did not berate poor black men in public he spoke THE TRUTH!

Yes He did.........berate poor blacks.
To berate is to criticize, in this case it was a destructive form of criticism.... To turn the suffering of the poor into a public mocking, to make a laughing stock of the pain poor blacks endure, to use the circumstances and situation of poor blacks to humiliate and shame them.
NO that which he said is not the whole truth,....that is scorn and judgement.

Truth....No he just did the same thing rappers been doing in their songs DESCRIBING whats happening in the hood.
Big difference is he stands on the outside blames the victim for being victims.....thereby siding with VICTIMIZERS and justifying the VICTIMIZATION.
Truth is deeper than a description....Truth can only be arrived at through understanding

Why are we SO afraid to speak the truth about the rampant irresponsibility of many men in the Jamaican and African American community. What are we afraid of. Don't want yt to know....trust me dem know LONG time as they are the ones who started it.

I am afraid because its a lie.....when the rich powerful and respected lies on you, you should be very afraid. The Rich Powerful and Respect make things happen.......they are called Movers and Shakers for a reason

A Lie repeated often enough by the right people may begin to convince people who are in positions of power, who upon hearing his ill and misinform diatribe may make decision or see it as an opportunity up on which to launch programs or institute procedures that will negatively impact poor inner city blacks......In short it seems he was laying the base or providing the pretext for a another racist onslaught or more ill conceived ideas whose intentions are to help but always seems to only victimize poor blacks more.

Poor black men are no more irresponsible that any other race given the same circumstances.

It is of less concern to me what white people think of blacks....I am more concern with what blacks think of themselves

[Tropicana]

No he spoke the truth about the lack of responsibility of fathers that causes a host of social problems in our community. As long as we continue to deny the truth, theses problems will continue generation after generation and our people will be permanent underclass in the USA, Canada and the UK.

[franksterr]

No he spoke the truth about the lack of responsibility of fathers that causes a host of social problems in our community. As long as we continue to deny the truth, theses problems will continue generation after generation and our people will be permanent underclass in the USA, Canada and the UK.

KAKA..

The most or major problems in the poor black Community is not a result of the "lack of responsibility of fathers"......The so called "absent black father" is a Myth, when compared to other racial groups.

It's a Myth predicated up on various social engineering projects that were under way. Yes through social programs and clandestine operations the Establishment tried to create such a phenomenon but failed.

Our people will be an "underclass only through lack of any of the following, proper education, skill training, living wage, access to and control of political, economic, social, civil resources, and a just and fair society. Lacking any of the above elements in our community is a serious threat to our survival.....Not some untrue made up crap about "absent black fathers"

[Tropicana]

Gleaner Company Ltd.

The Cost Of Absent Fathers

Fatherlessness is an albatross around the neck of this nation, weighing us down and choking development. We have elevated the single mother to near national hero, right up there near Nanny of the Maroons. But this sentimental elevation does not change the harsh facts of the negative impact of father absence.The best data on the impact on children of father absence comes out of the United States, and there sociologist David Popenoe has made quite a name for himself studying Life Without Father, the title of his flagship book on the subject. The Americans are more concerned with father absence from the rising divorce trend there, although African Americans lead that country with 65 per cent out-of-marriage births, while managing to remain at the economic base of the society, a condition usually and conveniently blamed on race rather than on family.
Our fatherlessness problem is being a world leader in fathering children outside marriage or even permanent committed relationships, something which we have glorified and normalised. The 2011 census says 68 per cent of Jamaicans over 16 (why starting at 16?) have never married, against a mere 24 per cent which have and remain married. Over 80 per cent of Jamaican children are born out of wedlock. The majority of these used to not even have their father's name on their birth certificate, the most basic association with a father. The Registrar General's Department has been trying to change this, and it would be good to hear what the current figure is.
NO COMMITMENT
This extraordinary national lack of commitment to formal marriage would be bad and not too bad if stable and permanent alternative relationships were the order of the day. But we know that the loose visiting relationship starting early in life, with multiple sequential partnerships over the prime childbearing and child-rearing years, is a main feature of man-woman-child relationship here.
Writing late last century, the sociologist of fatherhood, David Popenoe, declared, "The decline of fatherhood is one of the most unexpected and extraordinary social trends of our time. In just three decades - 1960 to 1990 - the number of children living apart from their biological fathers [that is: natural fathers] nearly doubled. By the turn of the century, almost 50 per cent of North American children may be going to sleep each evening without being able to say good night to their dads."
Popenoe is talking about divorce in the United States. We are talking about fathers who have never made the commitment of marriage or even of sticking around.
There was a time when fatherlessness was high on account of death. But: "A surprising suggestion emerging from recent social-science research," Popenoe points out, "is that it is decidedly worse to a child to lose a father in the modern, voluntary way than through death. The children of divorced and never-married mothers are less successful by almost every measure than the children of widowed mothers ... . And there is reason to believe that having an unmarried father is even worse for a child than having a divorced father."
And the statistical analyses of the US data are showing that children from a fatherless home are:
20 times more likely to end up in prison;
32 times more likely to run away.
20 times more likely to have behavioural disorders.
14 times more likely to commit rape;
Nine times more likely to drop out of high school;
10 times more likely to abuse drugs;
Five times more likely to commit suicide;
Nine times more likely to end up in a state-operated institution;
Two times more likely to have children during their teenage years;
The litany of disaster continues in the US statistics:
85% of all children that exhibit behavioural disorders come from fatherless homes;
90% of all homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes;
71% of all high-school dropouts come from fatherless homes;
71% of teenage pregnancies are to children of single parents, so the cycle continues;
75% of all adolescent patients in chemical-abuse centres come from fatherless homes;
63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes;
80% of rapists come from fatherless homes;
70% of juveniles in state facilities come from fatherless homes;
85% of all incarcerated youths grew up in a fatherless home.

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20130526/focus/focus3.html

[Tropicana]

2015 Gleaner Company Ltd

Mothers, Children, Fathers


African-Americans lead their country in father absenteeism, with 65 per cent out-of-marriage births, while stubbornly stuck, like Mama Toya and her fatherless children, at the economic base of the society, a condition usually and very conveniently blamed on race rather than on family. Our own 2011 census says 68 per cent of Jamaicans over 16 have never married, against a mere 24 per cent who have and remain married. More than 80 per cent of Jamaican children are born out of wedlock. The majority of these used to not even have their fathers' names on their birth certificates, the most basic association with a father. The Registrar General's Department has been trying to change this.Our extraordinary national lack of commitment to formal marriage would be bad and not too bad if stable and permanent alternative relationships were the order of the day. But the loose visiting relationship starting early in life, with multiple sequential partnerships over the prime childbearing and child-rearing years, is a main feature of man-woman-child relationships here.

Single Mother Pride


We may have elevated the single mother to almost national hero status, right up there near Nanny of the Maroons, but fatherlessness is a millstone around our national neck, weighing us down and choking development. The Government is beginning to catch on. Minister of National Security Peter Bunting has said the lack of a father figure is one of the main reasons many young men join gangs and get involved in a life of crime. He is not shooting from the lips.
And Minister of Education Ronald Thwaites has said the lack of a father in many Jamaican homes must be viewed as a socio-economic disability. This absence, he added, often hampers the development of these children in many respects.
"Weak family structure is a chronic disability within the Jamaican society ... ; it is a disability when you don't have a stable structure - a relationship between mother and father - in the raising of a child. It compounds all the other issues. It is something so sensitive that we need to bring it into the open and deal with it," he states. Interestingly, the minister said this while addressing a conference last year on Promoting the Rights of Children with Disabilities!
US statistical data are showing that children from fatherless homes are 20 times more likely to end up in prison; 32 times more likely to run away; 20 times more likely to have behavioural disorders; 14 times more likely to commit rape; nine times more likely to drop out of high school; 10 times more likely to abuse drugs; five times more likely to commit suicide; nine times more likely to end up in a state-operated institution; two times more likely to have children during their teenage years (perpetuating the cycle).
There is more from there: 85% of all children that exhibit behavioural disorders come from fatherless homes; 90% of all homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes; 71% of all high-school dropouts come from fatherless homes; 71% of teenage pregnancies are to children of single parents, so the cycle continues; 75% of all adolescent patients in chemical-abuse centres come from fatherless homes; 63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes; 80% of rapists come from fatherless homes; 70% of juveniles in state facilities come from fatherless homes; 85% of all incarcerated youth grew up in fatherless homes.

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/article/focus/20150510/mothers-children-fathers

[Tropicana]

Jamaica Observer

Breeders, not fathers

Psychologist says slave past created bad Jamaican dads

Family Psychologist Dr Barry Davidson has blamed slavery for the failure of many Jamaican men to adequately fulfil their role as fathers.
Davidson believes the legacy of enslavement of Caribbean people is why many "Afro-Jamaican" men from all classes of society are struggling to be good fathers. He believes many men, regardless of social class, were not taught or properly socialised to be good dads and noted that while the problem is mostly visible among the poor, it also exists among middle and upper-class Jamaican males who can provide financially for their children, but often neglect them emotionally.
"Fathers who should be important partners are too often absent from the parenting process. This situation demands that we pay particular attention to the issue of the psychology of the Jamaican male," Davidson said recently while addressing the theme, Effective Parenting: Empowering for Life at Northern Caribbean University's (NCU) 4th Biennial Conference of the College of Humanities, Behavioural and Social Sciences in Mandeville.
"The big challenge is to bring about a self-awareness on the part of our men. Self-awareness demands that we first understand the history of the Jamaican male. For some it is too painful to deal with, for others it is used as an excuse for irresponsibility. In slavery, men were only to be breeders and not fathers. For at least 179 years (from British conquest to emancipation) the male slaves were robbed of their birthright of learning to be proper fathers and providers. They could not as easily pass on virtues and facts of fatherhood to their sons by example or oral tradition. Family psychology informs us that the problems from parents to children pass several generations."
However, he feels that although single-parent, mainly female-headed households are predominant in Jamaica, it is the desire of most Jamaican men to be protectors and providers for their families, and loving fathers and disciplinarians for their children.
Davidson said that men suffer mentally when they are not able to fulfil their roles as fathers and this results in what he describes as the "male pain". This male pain, he said, drives them to relationships with "outside" women where no deep commitment or responsibility is required; to being abusive to their partners; drug and alcohol use; or being a workaholic, among other negative behaviour.
Custos Rotulorum of Manchester Sally Porteous agreed with the psychologist, telling the gathering, "it cannot be denied that the breakdown of parenting has contributed to the kind of angry, violent and deviant behaviour that exists in our society today. In my political life, I have seen too many broken homes, stressed mothers and absent, drunken fathers. This revolving door of reckless behaviour and irresponsibility that has become the norm is terrifying and in the midst of it all, are children, alone and frightened, living in a kind of emotional vacuum, struggling to exist among all of this."

http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Breeders--not-fathers_11200276

[franksterr]

Jamaica Observer



http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/...thers_11200276

As usual you miss the real issue in your mad drive to prove your misguided point....
First Bill Cosby was not addressing Jamaicans or the international black community, he was specifically addressing poor inner city blacks of the USA... so both you links are Irrelevant.

Nevertheless I will accept them for the sake of argument as corresponding or comparable evidence as oppose to corroborated or correlated evidence.

Second I am not disputing the effects of absentee fathers on the child but the rate of absentee fathers in the black community vis a vis other races or ethnic communities given the same situation.

Third Bill Cosby was addressing Poor blacks, but as per your Observer article, this happens across the social strata in Jamaica.

Davidson believes the legacy of enslavement of Caribbean people is why many "Afro-Jamaican" men from all classes of society are struggling to be good fathers. He believes many men, regardless of social class, were not taught or properly socialised to be good dads and noted that while the problem is mostly visible among the poor, it also exists among middle and upper-class Jamaican males who can provide financially for their children, but often neglect them emotionally.

Dr Davidson of the same article goes on to explain a condition he calls "male Pain but does not identify the causes of this malady. I submit it has more to do with present day International Interventionist Policies than historical vestigial effects of slavery.

it is the desire of most Jamaican men to be protectors and providers for their families, and loving fathers and disciplinarians for their children.Davidson said that men suffer mentally when they are not able to fulfil their roles as fathers and this results in what he describes as the "male pain".

Fourth Martin Henry the writer of the Gleaner article makes the same mistake you did by conflating issues. By using statistics on various related issues which may or may not have a bearing on absentee fathers such as, out of wedlock births, Never married individuals, and missing of fathers name on birth certificates with being an actual absentee fathers.

African-Americans lead their country in father absenteeism, with 65 per cent out-of-marriage births,while stubbornly stuck, like Mama Toya and her fatherless children, at the economic base of the society, a condition usually and very conveniently blamed on race rather than on family. Our own 2011 census says 68 per cent of Jamaicans over 16 have never married, against a mere 24 per cent who have and remain married. More than 80 per cent of Jamaican children are born out of wedlock. The majority of these used to not even have their fathers' names on their birth certificates, the most basic association with a father. The Registrar General's Department has been trying to change this

Lastly A more direct long standing report puts the whole entire issue to rest and directly refutes the assertions of Gleaner writer Martin Henry especially with respects to US blacks over all.

The Pew Research Center, which has tracked this data for years, consistently finds no big differences between white and black fathers. Gretchen Livingston, one of the senior researchers studying family life at Pew, wasn’t at all surprised by the new CDC data. “Blacks look a lot like everyone else,” she pointed out.

Although black fathers are more likely to live separately from their children — the statistic that’s usually trotted out to prove the parenting “crisis” — many of them remain just as involved in their kids’ lives. Pew estimates that 67 percent of black dads who don’t live with their kids see them at least once a month, compared to 59 percent of white dads and just 32 percent of Hispanic dads.
And there’s compelling evidence that number of black dads living apart from their kids stems from structural systems of inequality and poverty, not the unfounded assumption that African-American men somehow place less value on parenting. Equal numbers of black dads and white dads tend to agree that it’s important to be a father who provides emotional support, discipline, and moral guidance. There’s one area of divergence in the way the two groups approach their parental responsibilities: Black dads are even more likely to think it’s important to financially provide for their children

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2014...-black-father/

[Tropicana]

Duh ...what part of:

African-Americans lead their country in father absenteeism, with 65 per cent out-of-marriage births,while stubbornly stuck, like Mama Toya and her fatherless children, at the economic base of the society, a condition usually and very conveniently blamed on race rather than on family

...are you having trouble understanding. These dynamics also apply to African American families. True the Jamaican figures have been worse...up around 80% at times.

[Tropicana]

Since you want to talk about African American families...hold dis:

On Father's Day 2012, Black Fathers Need to Stop Being Absentee Dads and Start Parenting

A recent article in the Wall Street Journal discussed the differences between Western and Chinese parenting. The author, Professor Amy Chua, praised a parenting style of not allowing her children to go on play dates, encouraging them to play the piano and violin, and choosing their extracurricular activities for them. Western parents, she argued, are way too sensitive about their children’s feelings and, consequently, never push their children to their greatest potential.
I am struck, however, by my realization that the experiences of the author – and her critique of Western parents – fell outside of what most African-American children experience. That is, many black children do not even have the luxury of a two-parent household.

It is no secret that many African-American children do not see their fathers. The problem is so widespread that then-Senator Barack Obama discussed the perils of absentee black fathers in a speech on Father’s Day in 2008 — in the middle of the presidential campaign. In his speech, Senator Obama noted that more than half of African-American children live in single-parent households. Those children who grow up without their fathers are more likely to drop out of school, become criminals, and end up in prison. These effects are detrimental to the African-American community and our entire country in general.

Obama pulled no punches in his assessment: Black fathers “have abandoned their responsibilities, acting like boys instead of men. And the foundations of our families are weaker because of it.”

So instead of getting parents who don’t push their kids enough, African-American children just aren’t getting both parents. Many African-American mothers are doing the best that they can, but their efforts still come short because they do not have help. What kids need more than anything is for their parents – optimally, both parents – to be present in their lives.

Being present does not simply mean being physically available either. It calls for parents to be mentally, emotionally, and spiritually present as well. Kids need the full support of their parents — not just their parents’ unmet dreams thrust unfittingly upon them. Children need their parents to listen to them. Learn their interests. Study their habits. Discover their goals and strengths. Parents need to provide their children with emotional support that is empowering and not prescriptive or stifling. Kids need love.

The debate between Western and other non-Western forms of parenting is worth having. But for now, in my community, we need more fathers to be present. In all communities, we need all of our parents to be more present, beyond the physical.

What’s the use of forcing your son to learn the piano if he is truly a poet instead? What’s the use of forcing your daughter to learn ballet if her true passion rests in the science lab? What’s the use of forcing your kids to love something they don’t understand when they really just need your love and understanding?

For now, be present. And that’s not just for the African-American families. Chinese parents, I’m sure can do the same. And Korean, Indian, and Ghanaian parents too. We can worry about whether or not we’re pushing kids too hard or not enough once we realize what their true passions are and have spent enough time listening to and watching them. First, be present— in body, mind, and spirit.

http://mic.com/articles/393/on-father-s-day-2012-black-fathers-need-to-stop-being-absentee-dads-and-start-parenting

[Tropicana]

I LOVE this man:

[Tropicana]

This too from President Obama....

Of all the rocks upon which we build our lives, we are reminded today that family is the most important. And we are called to recognize and honor how critical every father is to that foundation. They are teachers and coaches. They are mentors and role models. They are examples of success and the men who constantly push us toward it.But if we are honest with ourselves, we’ll admit that what too many fathers also are is missing — missing from too many lives and too many homes. They have abandoned their responsibilities, acting like boys instead of men. And the foundations of our families are weaker because of it.
You and I know how true this is in the African-American community. We know that more than half of all black children live in single-parent households, a number that has doubled — doubled — since we were children. We know the statistics — that children who grow up without a father are five times more likely to live in poverty and commit crime; nine times more likely to drop out of schools and 20 times more likely to end up in prison. They are more likely to have behavioral problems, or run away from home or become teenage parents themselves. And the foundations of our community are weaker because of it.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0608/11094.html

[franksterr]

Duh ...what part of:
African-Americans lead their country in father absenteeism, with 65 per cent out-of-marriage births,while stubbornly stuck, like Mama Toya and her fatherless children, at the economic base of the society, a condition usually and very conveniently blamed on race rather than on family



...are you having trouble understanding. These dynamics also apply to African American families. True the Jamaican figures have been worse...up around 80% at times.

Out of marriage birth does not equate to absentee father, that's a false equivalence, That 65% is for out-of-Marriage-birth Capisce. Plus the CDC and Pew research that I cited also refutes that conclusion..

In fact, in its coverage of the study, the Los Angeles Times noted that the results “defy stereotypes about black fatherhood” because the CDC found that black dads are more involved with their kids on a daily basis than dads from other racial groups:

CREDIT: LOS ANGELES TIMES

In some cases, the differences between black fathers and white or Latino fathers weren’t statistically significant. Nonetheless, the fact that there’s no dramatic drop-off for African-American fathers is still a surprising revelation for some people.

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2014...-black-father/

Again for the umpteenth time let me repeat that what I am saying is that given the same situation blacks fathers are no more absent from their families than any other Ethnic group.

So even if its doubled over years in the black community in the black community it is still less than all other ethnic group at the present time....So Bill was wrong to single out poor black father as being the poster child for absentee fathers.

Obama criticism is constructive where Bill's was Destructive......Obama has it right when he said the following....

, we need more money for our schools, and more outstanding teachers in the classroom, and more after-school programs for our children. Yes, we need more jobs and more job training and more opportunity in our communities....... I screwed up more often than I should’ve, but I got plenty of second chances

So stop creating straw man arguments, just to tear them down so as to fool yourself into believing you have made your point.

POOR BLACKS ARE NO MORE "ABSENT FATHER" FROM THEIR FAMILIES THAN ANY OTHER ETHNIC GROUP......you are caught up in a propaganda created myth - free your mind sista, free your mind.

[Tropicana]

Black-Poverty-2012-Statistics-chart.jpg

According to the 2012 U.S. Census Bureau American Community Survey The poverty rate for all African Americans in 2012 was 28.1% which is an increase from 25.5% in 2005. Actually the poverty rate increased between 2005 and 2012 for every demographic of African Americans except those ages 65 and over who experienced a decrease from 21.2% to 19%. Black families with children under 18 headed by a single mother have the highest rate of poverty at 47.5 compared to only 8.4% percent of married-couple Black families.

Oh but everything is just peachy-keen and wonderful.

Historical-Poverty-Chart-of-Black-Families.jpg

72 Percent Of Black Kids Raised By Single Parent, 25% Overall In U.S.

One in four children in the United States is being raised by a single parent — a percentage that has been on the rise and is higher than other developed countries, according to a report released Wednesday.
Of the 27 industrialized countries studied by the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development, the U.S. had 25.8 percent of children being raised by a single parent, compared with an average of 14.9 percent across the other countries.
In the African American community, 72 percent of Black children are raised in a single parent household.

[franksterr]

[ATTACH]3032[/ATTACH]

Oh but everything is just peachy-keen and wonderful.

[ATTACH]3033[/ATTACH]

It looks like I will not be getting through that skull of yours, Bill Cosby speech was an attack on Poor black families in inner city USA, and Bill lay blame on the prevalence of Absentee Fathers in the Black community.
My Contention has been and still remains so, is that poor black father Absenteeism is no more than in any other ethnic group.

Black poverty rates and Single Mother/Parent Headed Household Rates are related issues but not the same issue as Absentee Fatherhood.
We are not discussing Black poverty and Single parent Headed household. We are discussing Absent Fathers in the poor inner cities of US which is who Bill was addressing and so was Obama. The issue has been resolved by the Pew research and the CDC as a Myth
If You wish to discuss Black Poverty Rates and Single Parent/Mother Headed Household please start a thread and I will gladly aid in the dismissal any of your misconceptions.

Until you post links addressing the issue of Absentee fathers I will rest my case.