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Libya to help the protestors...should the US get involved in either way?????
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: evanovitch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Libya to help the protestors...should the US get involved in either way????? </div></div>
From Al-Jazeera, a superior source of news on the Arab world uprisings.
Check out the names of those backing intervention.
These are the same people who lied us into the Iraq War.
Neo-cons urge Libya intervention
Signatories to the Project for the New American Century (PNAC) demand "immediate" military action.
Jim Lobe Last Modified: 27 Feb 2011 16:00 GMT
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Independent Senator Joseph Lieberman wants the US to arm Libyan rebels [GALLO/GETTY]
In a distinct echo of the tactics they pursued to encourage US intervention in the Balkans and Iraq, a familiar clutch of neo-conservatives appealed Friday for the United States and NATO to "immediately" prepare military action to help bring down the regime of Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi and end the violence that is believed to have killed well over a thousand people in the past week.
The appeal, which came in the form of a letter signed by 40 policy analysts, including more than a dozen former senior officials who served under President George W. Bush, was organised and released by the Foreign Policy Initiative (FPI), a two-year-old neo-conservative group that is widely seen as the successor to the more-famous – or infamous – Project for the New American Century (PNAC).
Warning that Libya stood "on the threshold of a moral and humanitarian catastrophe", the letter, which was addressed to President Barack Obama, called for specific immediate steps involving military action, in addition to the imposition of a number of diplomatic and economic sanctions to bring "an end to the murderous Libyan regime".
In particular, it called for Washington to press NATO to "develop operational plans to urgently deploy warplanes to prevent the regime from using fighter jets and helicopter gunships against civilians and carry out other missions as required; (and) move naval assets into Libyan waters" to "aid evacuation efforts and prepare for possible contingencies;" as well as "(e)stablish the capability to disable Libyan naval vessels used to attack civilians."
The usual suspects
Among the letter's signers were former Bush deputy defence secretary Paul Wolfowitz; Bush's top global democracy and Middle East adviser; Elliott Abrams; former Bush speechwriters Marc Thiessen and Peter Wehner; Vice President Dick Cheney's former deputy national security adviser, John Hannah, as well as FPI's four directors: Weekly Standard editor William Kristol; Brookings Institution fellow Robert Kagan; former Iraq Coalition Provisional Authority spokesman Dan Senor; and former Undersecretary of Defense for Policy and Ambassador to Turkey, Eric Edelman.
It was Kagan and Kristol who co-founded and directed PNAC in its heyday from 1997 to the end of Bush's term in 2005.
The letter comes amid growing pressure on Obama, including from liberal hawks, to take stronger action against Gaddafi.
Two prominent senators whose foreign policy views often reflect neo-conservative thinking, Republican John McCain and Independent Democrat Joseph Lieberman, called Friday in Tel Aviv for Washington to supply Libyan rebels with arms, among other steps, including establishing a no-fly zone over the country.
On Wednesday, Obama said his staff was preparing a "full range of options" for action. He also announced that Secretary of State Hillary Clinton will meet fly to Geneva Monday for a foreign ministers' meeting of the UN Human Rights Council to discuss possible multilateral actions.
"They want to keep open the idea that there's a mix of capabilities they can deploy – whether it's a no-fly zone, freezing foreign assets of Gaddafi's family, doing something to prevent the transport of mercenaries (hired by Gaddafi) to Libya, targeting sanctions against some of his supporters to persuade them to abandon him," said Steve Clemons of the New America Foundation, who took part in a meeting of independent foreign policy analysts, including Abrams, with senior National Security Council staff at the White House Thursday.
Interventions
During the 1990s, neo-conservatives consistently lobbied for military pressure to be deployed against so-called "rogue states", especially in the Middle East.
After the 1991 Gulf War, for example, many "neo-cons" expressed bitter disappointment that US troops stopped at the Kuwaiti border instead of marching to Baghdad and overthrowing the regime of Saddam Hussein.
When the Iraqi president then unleashed his forces against Kurdish rebels in the north and Shia insurgents in the south, they – along with many liberal interventionist allies – pressed President George H.W. Bush to impose "no-fly zones" over both regions and take additional actions - much as they are now proposing for Libya - designed to weaken the regime's military repressive capacity.
Those actions set the pattern for the 1990s. To the end of the decade, neo-conservatives, often operating under the auspices of a so-called "letterhead organisation", such as PNAC, worked – often with the help of some liberal internationalists eager to establish a right of humanitarian intervention - to press President Bill Clinton to take military action against adversaries in the Balkans – in Bosnia and then Kosovo – as well as Iraq.
Within days of 9/11, for example, PNAC issued a letter signed by 41 prominent individuals – almost all neo- conservatives, including 10 of the Libya letter's signers – that called for military action to "remove Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq", as well as retaliation against Iran and Syria if they did not immediately end their support for Hezbollah in Lebanon.
PNAC and its associates subsequently worked closely with neo-conservatives inside the Bush administration, including Abrams, Wolfowitz, and Edelman, to achieve those aims.
Liberal hawks
While neo-conservatives were among the first to call for military action against Gaddafi in the past week, some prominent liberals and rights activists have rallied to the call, including three of the letter's signatories: Neil Hicks of Human Rights First; Bill Clinton's human rights chief, John Shattuck; and Leon Wieseltier of The New Republic, who also signed the PNAC Iraq letter 10 years ago.
In addition, Anne-Marie Slaughter, until last month the influential director of the State Department's Policy Planning office, cited the U.S.-NATO Kosovo campaign as a possible precedent. "The international community cannot stand by and watch the massacre of Libyan protesters," she wrote on Twitter. "In Rwanda we watched. In Kosovo we acted."
Such comments evoked strong reactions from some military experts, however.
"I'm horrified to read liberal interventionists continue to suggest the ease with which humanitarian crises and regional conflicts can be solved by the application of military power," wrote Andrew Exum, a counter-insurgency specialist at the Center for a New American Security. "To speak so glibly of such things reflects a very immature understanding of the limits of force and the difficulties and complexities of contemporary military operations."
Opposition
Other commentators noted that a renewed coalition of neo- conservatives and liberal interventionists would be much harder to put together now than during the Balkan wars of the 1990s.
"We now have Iraq and Afghanistan as warning signs, as well as our fiscal crisis, so I don't think there's an enormous appetite on Capitol Hill or among the public for yet another military engagement," said Charles Kupchan, a foreign policy specialist at the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR).
"I support diplomatic and economic sanctions, but I would stop well short of advocating military action, including the imposition of a no-fly zone," he added, noting, in any event, that most of the killing in Libya this week has been carried out by mercenaries and paramilitaries on foot or from vehicles.
"There may be some things we can do – such as airlifting humanitarian supplies to border regions where there are growing number of refugees, but I would do so only with the full support of the Arab League and African Union, if not the UN," said Clemons.
"(The neo-conservatives) are essentially pro-intervention, pro-war, without regard to the costs to the country," he said. "They don't recognise that we're incredibly over- extended and that the kinds of things they want us to do actually further weaken our already-eroded stock of American power."
A version of this article first appeared on the Inter Press Service News Agency. -
Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons t
Do they need more weapons than they already have ?
John need fi guh mek appt fi fix him prosthesis shoulder dem and mind him business, if him want sitten fi di guh help Wisconsin and dem budget debaucle otherwise shut him trap.Comment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> From Al-Jazeera, a superior source of news on the Arab world uprisings.
</div></div>
as an aside JC, how much leeway do u think they have in true reporting given that they r owned by the ruler of Qatar? i listened to an interview recently wid the guy who use to run them r still runs it..anyway he was a Canadian...want to hear ur ansa before i say wat he saidComment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: evanovitch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Libya to help the protestors...should the US get involved in either way????? </div></div>
what a joke...
what would they do if the population inna merkka decided to challenge the tyranny right here at home...
as long as they can point the finger about how supposedly bad somewhere else is they can keep their own population under the thumb...
bush, mccain, obama...
kadaffyComment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: evanovitch</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> From Al-Jazeera, a superior source of news on the Arab world uprisings.
</div></div>
as an aside JC, how much leeway do u think they have in true reporting given that they r owned by the ruler of Qatar? i listened to an interview recently wid the guy who use to run them r still runs it..anyway he was a Canadian...want to hear ur ansa before i say wat he said </div></div>
evanovitch,
I read and listen to a great many news sources on foreign affairs/world affairs and have for well over 40 years.
I know manure when I read and see it and I also know good reporting when I see it.
I also have the advantage of relying on and doing the bulk of my reading in left sources which is far more reliable in those subject areas and can see not only what they print but understand what they don't print and thereby determining what their agenda is; what is their ideological slant.
Many, perhaps most people do not get to understand that the mass media is not only not reliable, but indeed, has a tendency to disinform the public.
I'll say what I always say: read Al-Jazeera on subjects about which you feel already informed and then judge for yourself whether they are objective or not.
Understand that because they are rather more objective than the Western media, you
will read things that speak badly about the United States foreign policy and these are things the U.S media will not print or air. Because of this you get charges from the right wing that Al-Jazeera is anti-U.S. and the general public will believe that charge because all they know is what they have been told and not what they have never been told until Al- Jazeera printed it.
The right wing blue collar American will not read Al-Jazeera nor will most people in the U.S if only because it sounds SO foreign and besides Rush Limbaugh has told them it's anti-American.
Wherever Al-Jazeera is head quartered, they evidently haven't said anything about the government in that Gulf state that had them get shut down.
So they will be a round and doing a much better job than the U.S media IMOComment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
"bush, mccain, obama...
kadaffy"
jah_yout,
That's not really a fair comparison. You know that kind of quiz question where they give you a group of four things and ask you to indicate which does not belong in that group?
Well suppose we asked the question:
Which of the four men below has been responsible for killing the fewest people around the world over the length of his service in positions in which he authorized the killings:
McCain?, Obama? , Bush? , Gadaffi?Comment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
IMHO the US needs to stay out of it!Comment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: evanovitch</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> From Al-Jazeera, a superior source of news on the Arab world uprisings.
</div></div>
as an aside JC, how much leeway do u think they have in true reporting given that they r owned by the ruler of Qatar? i listened to an interview recently wid the guy who use to run them r still runs it..anyway he was a Canadian...want to hear ur ansa before i say wat he said </div></div>
Qatar is one of the most pro-US countries in the region - don't be fooled.
And Al Jazeera employs men like David Frost - whose side do you think he bats for - the Arabs?Comment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jamaica_dreamin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">IMHO the US needs to stay out of it! </div></div>
But what about all that oil
All now nobody nuh say nutten bout sending soldiers into the Sudan.7/5th of all people do not understand fractions.Comment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And Al Jazeera employs men like David Frost - whose side do you think he bats for - the Arabs? </div></div>
Probably he's a CIA plant?
As of November 2006, David Frost has worked for Al Jazeera English, presenting a live weekly hour-long current affairs programme, Frost Over the World, which started when the network launched in November 2006. The programme has regularly made headlines with interviewees such as Tony Blair, President Omar al-Bashir of Sudan, Benazir Bhutto and President Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua. The programme is produced by the former Question Time editor and Independent on Sunday journalist Charlie Courtauld. He was one of the first to interview the man who authored the historic fatwa on terrorism, Dr Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri.
He is a patron and former vice-president of the Motor Neurone Disease Association charity, as well as being a patron of the Alzheimer's Research Trust, the Hearing Trust, East Anglia's Children's Hospices, the Home Farm Trust and the Elton John AIDS Foundation.
Mean World Syndrome??Comment
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
yeah,,send them weapons, and in ten years theyll point the same gun back at them.
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: f0rTyLeGz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The programme has regularly made headlines with interviewees such as Benazir Bhutto </div></div>
<span style="font-weight: bold">It was on Frost's show that Benazir Bhutto clearly stated that Bin Laden is dead. She's was a former president of the county next door, so I'm inclined to believe she knew what she was talking about.
Note the way she says it in a matter-of-fact kind of way, as if it is common knowledge.
But that part was edited out.</span>
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pepper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jamaica_dreamin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">IMHO the US needs to stay out of it! </div></div>
But what about all that oil
All now nobody nuh say nutten bout sending soldiers into the Sudan. </div></div>
I almost added because there is oil the US will send troops in. We don't care about human life. Oil is our God!
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Re: McCain calls for US to send troops r weapons to
Wait till they ask.. A no fly zone will protect the civilian demonstrators. The us is not unpopular in Libya.... They are still seen as one of the agents of their liberation \ independence after the WWII. Funny enough they saw Gman as the cause of the trouble during the embargo not the US.Comment
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