Racism and Jealousy

[Derek]

I only feel racist when I see a gorgeous, stunning, beautiful black woman with a non-black guy.

I only feel jealous when I see a gorgeous, stunning, beautiful black woman with a non-black guy.



Do you think racism may in part be based on jealousy?

[jah_yout]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

this is irrational, & so is racism...
it is a remnant of our primitive past

[neutral]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

I usually feel jealous whenever I see a gorgeous stunning beautiful woman with a guy of any colour.

[Cultcha]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

I only get jealous when it involves a woman I am personally involved with. When I see a stunningly beautiful woman (of any colour) with another man (of any coIour) I may experience a brief moment of envy.

[johnnycakes]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

Whenever I see a mixed race couple, I always think of a far distant future society in which we have homogenized to the point that we are all pretty much the same as far as color, basic body type and facial characteristics.
Then racial discrimination will be a thing of the far distant past. A faded memory of the bad old days.


Of course that is without including the medical/scientific manipulation of the genes as will be possible but just by the old fashioned method.

[franksterr]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I only feel racist when I see a gorgeous, stunning, beautiful black woman with a non-black guy.

I only feel jealous when I see a gorgeous, stunning, beautiful black woman with a non-black guy.



Do you think racism may in part be based on jealousy?
</div></div>

Racism is about power, if by jealous you mean to say you feel less powerful - emasculated in relation to the other guy then yes in that sense it has a bit of jealousy.

[Tulip]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: franksterr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Racism is about power, if by jealous you mean to say you feel less powerful - emasculated in relation to the other guy then yes in that sense it has a bit of jealousy. </div></div>

That's an interesting thought.

I have no frame of reference to respond to this question because I have no reaction to mixed couples. Whatever floats your boat. I don't have time but to look for someone to float mine.

While typing I had a moment to think about it and don't believe racism is about jealousy. It's more about stressing over who you think is entitled to what. I can see that it is a similar feeling to jealousy or envy but not really the same.

[andronian2]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

Is racism irrational, or is it based on an extreme distillation of rational self interest by the perpetrating group?
Because really, racism and the imposition of 'un-personhood' on non-European peoples was the ideology that allowed European imperialism.
This was quite beneficial to them economically and politcally so how was it irrational for them to go down that road?

Whether this extreme self-interest was right or not is another matter and a very easy question to answer.
But the reason I belaboured the point is to address the ideology implanted within colonized people of colour that 'white'/European goals are universal human goals.
Any resistance on their part to actions against their welfare is described as being due their moral deficiency.
This, in the face of a white power structure that has consistently acted self-interestedly to an extreme degree and only gave concessions out of self-interest.
Black people, during the cultural genocide (erroneously cast in purely economic terms as 'slavery'), were conditioned against acting in their self-interest.
Later on in America, during the struggle for equality, politcal terms such as 'reverse racism' were invented by white politicans to redefine any dimunition of white privilege as oppression of whites.

So there arre still black people that think that if they consider the interest 'blacks' they're being racist.
To be truly successful they believe they have to transcend 'being black' so they're very unlikely to see those around them as any aid to success.
That is why Asian immigrants can work together, build their buinesses and patronize them while black people rarely do.
Black people often give quick and easy access to the economic and political resources of their communities while being shocked to discover that they do not have reciprocal access to others'.
So, having bestowed what should have been bartered, they are forced to beg rather than bargain.
We are a people are very much into inclusive brotherhood and all that jazz but wisdom is needed in a world that is not constructed in our image.

[franksterr]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: andronian2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is racism irrational, or is it based on an extreme distillation of rational self interest by the perpetrating group?
Because really, racism and the imposition of 'un-personhood' on non-European peoples was the ideology that allowed European imperialism.
This was quite beneficial to them economically and politcally so how was it irrational for them to go down that road?

Whether this extreme self-interest was right or not is another matter and a very easy question to answer.
But the reason I belaboured the point is to address the ideology implanted within colonized people of colour that 'white'/European goals are universal human goals.
Any resistance on their part to actions against their welfare is described as being due their moral deficiency.
<span style="color: #FF0000">This, in the face of a white power structure that has consistently acted self-interestedly to an extreme degree and only gave concessions out of self-interest.
Black people, during the cultural genocide (erroneously cast in purely economic terms as 'slavery'), were conditioned against acting in their self-interest.
Later on in America, during the struggle for equality, politcal terms such as 'reverse racism' were invented by white politicans to redefine any dimunition of white privilege as oppression of whites</span>.

<span style="font-weight: bold">So there arre still black people that think that if they consider the interest 'blacks' they're being racist.</span>To be truly successful they believe they have to transcend 'being black' so they're very unlikely to see those around them as any aid to success.
That is why Asian immigrants can work together, build their buinesses and patronize them while black people rarely do.
Black people often give quick and easy access to the economic and political resources of their communities while being shocked to discover that they do not have reciprocal access to others'.
So, having bestowed what should have been bartered, they are forced to beg rather than bargain.
We are a people are very much into inclusive brotherhood and all that jazz but wisdom is needed in a world that is not constructed in our image. </div></div>

Well said.

[barosa]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Whenever I see a mixed race couple, I always think of a far distant future society in which we have homogenized to the point that we are all pretty much the same as far as color, basic body type and facial characteristics.
Then racial discrimination will be a thing of the far distant past. A faded memory of the bad old days.

</div></div>
I'm sorry, but if you believe what you have written above, then I have a few bridges (I own) which I want to sell you.. At best and only marginally will some of your fantasy be realized. For the most part, it will only be realized only in your dream when this planet approaches the end of it's doom. In other words NEVER! which does not mean that we wont get to a stage when we become more &quot;civilized&quot; to each other..

I am talking about REALITY here.. We seem to be forgetting the old adage and natural law ~ <span style="font-weight: bold">Self Preservation is the First Law of Nature</span> ; Some races took the intiiative to apply &quot;that law&quot;, a law which no doubt was forwarded by those who used it against others, benefitted from its use and are still at it..
___________________________________

Just like oil, the truth always surface to the top..

[andronian2]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: franksterr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Well said. </div></div>

Tanks man.
Mi afi tink bout dem tings fi mek sense a what a gwaan.

A lot of what goes on in black societies has to do with a successful mind transplant or in Marley's terms, mental slavery.
Because every culture has indigenous definitions of leadership, goodness, beauty, civility etc. that is in harmony with and reinforces their physical and spiritual nature.
So, to the extent that Europeans are different physically and spiritually from Africans/Asians etc. their definitions will reflect that.
Is black going to be naturally defined as beautiful for people not black?
Is harmony going to be the ideal for people that seek power?

So there can be nothing but a dysfunctional outcome for black people when they adopt 'white' cultural defintions as universal human definitions by which they should evaluate themselves.
However, having been separated from indigenous values first by force and sometimes by willing repudiation black people often have no alternative at their easy disposal.
Furthermore, the universality of 'white'/European viewpoints, the idea that what is good for them is automatically good for all people, is exactly the thing that is sold the rest of the world even in the post-colonial era.

So, in this context, skin-bleaching, obsessive-compulsive hair processing, distrust and colourism among the coloured, lighter colour as marriage criteria, etc. make perfect sense as phenomena.
They are the result of imbibing, digesting, and assimilating an alien value system that works against what is natural and thus 'self-preservational', with the inevitable result: self-destruction.
So much for the diagnosis though, what's the cure?

[andronian2]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">am talking about REALITY here.. We seem to be forgetting the old adage and natural law ~ Self Preservation is the First Law of Nature ; Some races took the intiiative to apply &quot;that law&quot;, a law which no doubt was forwarded by those who used it against others, benefitted from its use and are still at it.. cry</div></div>

Bway barosa, mi did a post when you post but mi frighten fi si how wi deh pon di same page.
Black people have been conditioned to see themselves as only fit for destruction if not by the spilling of blood, by the mixing of it.
Yet this is the same very thing that was always a cultural taboo in 'white' societies that had populations of African chattel.

[johnnycakes]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: barosa</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Whenever I see a mixed race couple, I always think of a far distant future society in which we have homogenized to the point that we are all pretty much the same as far as color, basic body type and facial characteristics.
Then racial discrimination will be a thing of the far distant past. A faded memory of the bad old days.

</div></div>
I'm sorry, but if you believe what you have written above, then I have a few bridges (I own) which I want to sell you.. At best and only marginally will some of your fantasy be realized. For the most part, it will only be realized only in your dream when this planet approaches the end of it's doom. In other words NEVER! which does not mean that we wont get to a stage when we become more &quot;civilized&quot; to each other..

I am talking about REALITY here.. We seem to be forgetting the old adage and natural law ~ <span style="font-weight: bold">Self Preservation is the First Law of Nature</span> ; Some races took the intiiative to apply &quot;that law&quot;, a law which no doubt was forwarded by those who used it against others, benefitted from its use and are still at it..
___________________________________

Just like oil, the truth always surface to the top.. </div></div>



barosa,

I think I can safely assume that you haven't read the post on the Singularity I posted under &quot;The most amazing article.......&quot; in this forum.
If you had read it and understood the implications of what is about 40 years down the road you'd see not only what humanity is capable of but what is almost sure to happen and it's all good.

Your thinking is mired in what has been and not what will be.

The human condition is not stagnant as you would have it. We are reasoning animals and we evolve in many ways and that includes as a society.

If you are a Creationist you have to believe that the Divine Creator could not create an immoral race to populate the Earth at the top of the heap.

If you're an evolutionist then the eventuality and inevitability of an Edenic planet is even more sure .

If on the other hand you think that humanity is evil at its base and is not evolving to a higher stage of civilization, that we will not achieve the advanced and higher form of being of which we are certainly capable, then you have my sympathy.

It's got to be a fairly depressing way to go through life.
.

[andronian2]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

Some people already have their Eden.
It's just that one man's Eden may be another's Hell.

Evolution is based on the idea of naturalistic selection of the fit genes for preservation and the unfit for annihilation.
Thus it enables those in Eden to say that those in Hell deserve to be there because something is inherently wrong with them.

I wouldn't view it as an ideology that can ever conceive of harmony since it is built on the concept of continuous deathly struggle.
In it, harmony can only emerge as an incidental consequence of mutual benefit since there is no notion of the intrinsic value of life.

Now is it surprising that such an ideology would spring out of Imperial Europe?
Friends of Darwin were quick to see the cultural use to which his concepts could be put and encouraged him to publish.

No more 'Christianisation' but raw annihiliation in the spirit of Darwinism as applied in the social dimension.
I'm not surprised that in 'the West' evolution has largely supplanted religion as an origination myth but I question whether 'others' should be interested.

[barosa]

Re: Racism and Jealousy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: andronian2</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">am talking about REALITY here.. We seem to be forgetting the old adage and natural law ~ Self Preservation is the First Law of Nature ; Some races took the intiiative to apply &quot;that law&quot;, a law which no doubt was forwarded by those who used it against others, benefitted from its use and are still at it.. cry</div></div>

Bway barosa, mi did a post when you post but mi frighten fi si how wi deh pon di same page.
Black people have been conditioned to see themselves as only fit for destruction if not by the spilling of blood, by the mixing of it.
Yet this is the same very thing that was always a cultural taboo in 'white' societies that had populations of African chattel. </div></div>

Adronian2, You've said it right!.. It's no accident that we find ourselves in this predicament.. It was all conceived, planned and orchestrated by &quot;those&quot; who decided to take advantage of races that were not nearly as warlike and which they considered beneath them.. Among the many, the aboriginese, the blacks/Africans, the various Indian tribes, Asian and others lived more closely in sync with Nature and their natural surroundings for milleniums.. We had &quot;wars&quot; with sticks, stones, arrows and spears while &quot;they&quot; developed all manner of weaponry, some happened to be lethal weapons of mass destruction and the rest is history as we all know...
__________________________________

Just like oil, the truth always surface to the top..