Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

**RichD** · 12-08-2011, 01:27 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KqrowBait</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: xKs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">its about time..
If only Fada God had turned his back on the great USofA the same way its been turning its back on the Fada....

Merry Christmus iya! </div></div>

Amen!

Unfortunately though, the back-turning has spread across to many other places. :-( </div></div>

i cant help but think that was an ironic pun

**KleenBaggy** · 12-08-2011, 01:31 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KqrowBait</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: xKs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">its about time..
If only Fada God had turned his back on the great USofA the same way its been turning its back on the Fada....

Merry Christmus iya! </div></div>

Amen!

Unfortunately though, the back-turning has spread across to many other places. :-( </div></div>

i cant help but think that was an ironic pun </div></div>

Imagination can be a dangerous thing.

**RichD** · 12-08-2011, 01:59 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

so the defender of christmas is the FNC not everybody got the memo

**sistactry** · 12-08-2011, 02:49 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KqrowBait</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A blogger's response to the article. Hear! Hear!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What I find amazing is how ‘insecure some people are in their [non-]faith’ that they cannot allow others to call a holiday what it is.

Christmas is Christmas; if you don’t celebrate Christ, then move on.

Hannukah is Channuka any way you spell it; if you are not a Jew, move on.

Kwanza is Kwanza; if you are afraid of candles, move on.

Ramadan is Ramadan; if you aren’t Muslim, go eat something.

If you want to avoid anything specific, go with the ‘Season’s Greetings’ or ‘Happy Holidays.’ Just don’t try to strip others of their joy and pleasure in their named holiday.

Red paper with the jolly-old-fat-man on it is Christmas wrapping. I know where I will do my shopping this year: at the nice stores.

</div></div>

</div></div>

fah real,

**Cultcha** · 12-08-2011, 03:06 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kotch_Foot_Milo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's unfortunate that the phrase <span style="font-weight: bold">"Merry Christmas" somehow became socially unacceptable here</span>. I don't know which is worse, wishing someone a Merry Christmas or dropping the F-bomb?

I wonder if in countries where Islam is the dominant religion, if greeting someone and using the term "Ramadan" in said greeting is considered insensitive or politically incorrect? </div></div>

in your circles? I have never been in any kind of circumstance of situation where that was unacceptable. I would be interested to hear where this occurred.

</div></div>

You're joking right?

Open your local newspaper man, read your favourite magazine or watch TV for a few minutes. You meant to say that you have not noticed that the vast majority of the ads will refer to "Happy Holidays". Remember when it use to be "Merry Christmas & Happy New year"?

Use the term Merry Christmas and run the risk of being labeled a bigot or a racist.

I see it every day where I work with the publications my company produces. 2009 was the last year we ran our annual Christmas gift Guide. Now it has been renamed to the more politically correct Holiday Gift Guide.

I actually have a copy of my community newspaper here with me. I count eleven "holiday" related ads. Only three of those eleven mention the word Christmas. The ones that do are the smaller mom and pop retailers or services. The ads for The Bay and Sears both use the term "holidays".

**RichD** · 12-08-2011, 03:21 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kotch_Foot_Milo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Open your local newspaper man, read your favourite magazine or watch TV for a few minutes. You meant to say that you have not noticed that the vast majority of the ads will refer to "Happy Holidays". Remember when it use to be "Merry Christmas & Happy New year"?

Use the term Merry Christmas and run the risk of being labeled a bigot or a racist.

I see it every day where I work with the publications my company produces. 2009 was the last year we ran our annual Christmas gift Guide. Now it has been renamed to the more politically correct Holiday Gift Guide.

I actually have a copy of my community newspaper here with me. I count eleven "holiday" related ads. Only three of those eleven mention the word Christmas. The ones that do are the smaller mom and pop retailers or services. The ads for The Bay and Sears both use the term "holidays". </div></div>

i don't question that the media(or some in the media) are pushing the concept of a secular holiday ..im questioning the unacceptability of the word in everyday life

**KleenBaggy** · 12-08-2011, 03:27 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kotch_Foot_Milo</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kotch_Foot_Milo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's unfortunate that the phrase <span style="font-weight: bold">"Merry Christmas" somehow became socially unacceptable here</span>. I don't know which is worse, wishing someone a Merry Christmas or dropping the F-bomb?

I wonder if in countries where Islam is the dominant religion, if greeting someone and using the term "Ramadan" in said greeting is considered insensitive or politically incorrect? </div></div>

in your circles? I have never been in any kind of circumstance of situation where that was unacceptable. I would be interested to hear where this occurred.

</div></div>

You're joking right?

Open your local newspaper man, read your favourite magazine or watch TV for a few minutes. You meant to say that you have not noticed that the vast majority of the ads will refer to "Happy Holidays". Remember when it use to be "Merry Christmas & Happy New year"?

Use the term Merry Christmas and run the risk of being labeled a bigot or a racist.

I see it every day where I work with the publications my company produces. 2009 was the last year we ran our annual Christmas gift Guide. Now it has been renamed to the more politically correct Holiday Gift Guide.

I actually have a copy of my community newspaper here with me. I count eleven "holiday" related ads. Only three of those eleven mention the word Christmas. The ones that do are the smaller mom and pop retailers or services. The ads for The Bay and Sears both use the term "holidays". </div></div>

Thank you!! I know it wasn't exclusive. This has been a chronic pandemic...

**KleenBaggy** · 12-08-2011, 03:31 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> i don't question that the media(or some in the media) are pushing the concept of a secular holiday ..im questioning the unacceptability of the word in everyday life </div></div>

To say <span style="font-weight: bold">"Merry Christmas"</span> has become socially unacceptable in my end of the world - i.e. North America, and from what I've heard, it has caught on in many other parts of the world as well

As stated before, you are seen to be an insensitive, non-accepting of others, troublemaker/terrorist if you as much as imply it, much less, say it.

**RichD** · 12-08-2011, 03:39 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

all i'm saying is i have never got that reaction and i don't buy that it is as wide spread as some will make out

**sistactry** · 12-08-2011, 03:47 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

MOUNT SINAI, N.Y. (CBSNewYork) -- It’s usually a controversy to call a Christmas tree event a “holiday event,” but this year in one Long Island town it’s the other way around and it’s causing people to pick a side.

As CBS 2&#8242;s Ann Mercogliano reports, while the ceremony may be centered on a big tree, some residents are complaining, saying it’s not enough about Christmas.

The annual “holiday tree lighting” ceremony in Mount Sinai has been the way here. No question, when this tree is lit on Sunday it will look just like a Christmas tree, but the event, residents say, has always been called the “holiday tree lighting” and they want to know: where’s the Christmas in that?

“A Christmas tree is a Christmas tree,” said David Black of Port Jefferson Station. “I want it to be called a Christmas tree. Yes, that’s what it is!”

“I just think it’s a menorah, it’s a Christmas tree and we should respect each other,” added Patricia Snider of Miller Place.

WCBS 880 Long Island Bureau Chief Mike Xirinachs On The Story

The holiday tree lighting has been a tradition in Mount Sinai since 1996, and it’s always been called just that.

But now calls from residents to change the name has sparked a discussion and even an online petition — with hits coming in from across the country.

The Heritage Trust non-profit that currently runs the lighting said it is staying neutral on this one, but a name change could be on the way.

“Whatever the will of the community is, that’s what the Heritage non-profit will do,” Heritage Trust’s Lori Baldassare said.

While there are calls to include the word “Christmas” in the name of the ceremony, the thought of changing tradition here doesn’t sit well with everyone.

“If they’re against it don’t come. If they’re for it, they come, but there shouldn’t be anything bad,” said Angelo Pontillo of Coram.

“What difference does it make what you call it? It’s a tree lighting, you’re gonna light the tree,” added Bob Brasen of Sound Beach.

“Christmas is for everybody,” a man told WCBS 880 Long Island Bureau Chief Mike Xirinachs.

The Heritage Trust said it has sent out a survey to residents asking what they want and based on the results of the survey they’ll decide what they’ll do. The Trust said they’ll announce at the tree lighting on Sunday what the community chose to do with the name.

What do you think? Should it be a Christmas celebration or a “holiday” celebration? Sound off in the comments section below

**jah_yout** · 12-08-2011, 04:06 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

i have noticed absolutely NO decrease in people saying "merry christmas"...

this is manufactured outrage that started appearing roughly after 9/11/01...

when we somehow had to prove we were more american or western or christian or whatever...

next you'll be telling me the christmas day is for celebrating the birth of jesus...

perhaps for some it is symbolically, but for most its about decorated trees, presents, santa clause, egg nog, reindeer, mistletoe, ham, turkey, snow, carols, etc.

some people say "happy holidays" because they know there are people of different faiths in america who celebrate different things and this is a generic way of including everyone- including christmas-- and the whole "holiday" season including boxing day where it applies and also new years

**KleenBaggy** · 12-08-2011, 04:16 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

Check this out:

<span style="font-weight: bold">Posted 12/21/2004 7:49 PM Updated 12/21/2004 8:17 PM </span>

Christians protest actions that play down Christmas' religious nature
By Richard Willing, USA TODAY

Julie West is tired of being wished "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas." She's annoyed with department stores that use "Season's Greetings" banners, and with public schools that teach about Hanukkah and Kwanzaa but won't touch the Nativity story.

<span style="font-weight: bold"> In a CNN/USA TODAY/Gallup Poll, 44% of Americans said the trend toward "Happy Holidays" is a change for the better, and 43% said it wasn't.</span>
AP file

So last week, she sent a baked protest to a holiday party at her first-grade son's school: a chocolate cake with vanilla frosting and red icing that spelled out "Happy Birthday Jesus."

"Christmas keeps getting downgraded, to the point that you're almost made to feel weird if you even mention it," says West, a resident of Edmonds, Wash., who describes herself as a non-denominational Christian. "What's the matter with recognizing the reason behind the whole holiday?"

This Christmas season, West has plenty of company. Christians and traditionalists across the nation, fed up with what they view as the de-emphasizing of Christmas as a religious holiday, are filing lawsuits, promoting boycotts and launching campaigns aimed at restoring references to Christ in seasonal celebrations.

From New Jersey to California, Christians are moving to counter years of lawsuits that have made governments wary about putting Nativity scenes on public property, and that occasionally have led schools to drop Christmas carols from holiday programs:

• In Bay Harbor Islands, Fla., a Christian sued in federal court after town officials refused to let her erect a Nativity scene next to a menorah, or Hanukkah candelabra, on a causeway. Last week, a judge ordered the town to comply.

• In Maplewood, N.J., parents and students recently petitioned the local school board after school officials dropped even instrumental versions of Christmas music from class programs.

• In Denver, a Protestant church responded to the city's decision to drop "Merry Christmas" from public signs by trying to enter a Christmas-themed float in the holiday parade. Supporters picketed the parade and sang Christmas carols after the float was rejected.

• In California, a group called the Committee to Save Merry Christmas is boycotting Federated Department Stores. The group claims that Federated's affiliates, including Macy's, prohibit clerks from saying "Merry Christmas" and ban the word "Christmas" from ads and store displays. The retail giant says it has no such policy.

Even Kwanzaa, the African-American harvest celebration, has taken a hit. In Los Angeles, the Rev. Jesse Lee Peterson, a conservative black activist, has urged black Christians to spurn Kwanzaa, which he calls a "pagan holiday."

Split over 'Happy Holidays'

The new battles over religion's role in holiday celebrations come more than two decades after the American Civil Liberties Union and other groups began going to court to try to require municipalities to remove Nativity scenes and other religious displays from public property. The ACLU argued that such religious symbols violated the First Amendment's ban on government-endorsed religion.

In two rulings in the 1980s, the U.S. Supreme Court said that Nativity scenes are acceptable when they are combined with other symbols — such as a Santa Claus house — that indicate Christmas is a secular holiday in American culture as well as a religious one.

Nevertheless, the threat of lawsuits and a desire to be more sensitive to the nation's growing number of non-Christians — who made up about 18% of the U.S. population in a 2002 survey by Pew Charitable Trusts — has led many governments, schools and businesses to de-emphasize Christ in Christmastime celebrations. Phrases such as "Happy Holidays" and "Season's Greetings" have replaced "Merry Christmas" at many public venues.

In a new CNN/USA TODAY/Gallup Poll, 44% of Americans surveyed said the trend toward "Happy Holidays" is a change for the better, and 43% said it wasn't. Only 11%, however, said they avoid saying "Merry Christmas" out of fear of offending someone.

Carol Sanger, spokeswoman for Federated Department Stores, says Federated employees use phrases such as "Season's Greetings" and "Happy Holidays" interchangeably with "Merry Christmas" in order to be "more reflective of the multicultural society in which we live."

She says the chain aims to "embrace all" the religious and secular holidays that occur in November and December.

"If you were Druid, I'd be wishing you a 'Scintillating Solstice,' " Sanger says.

John Whitehead, director of the Rutherford Institute, a group in Charlottesville, Va., that defends against challenges to speech and religion rights, says the recent trend has been for schools and municipalities to excise "all mention of Christmas, out of some misshapen idea that this respects diversity."

He is particularly critical of decisions such as that made by the school board in Maplewood, N.J., which decided to drop traditional carols and other Christmas music from public school programs during the mid-1990s after receiving several complaints.

This year, the ban was extended even to instrumental versions of Christmas songs.

Board President Brian O'Leary said in a statement that playing songs that "focus on religious holidays ... could become an opportunity not to learn about a religious holiday or tradition, but to celebrate it."

Bans are 'misplaced'

Charles Haynes, senior scholar at the First Amendment Center in Arlington, Va., says that such bans are "rare" and "misplaced."

Court decisions, Haynes says, permit public school students to study religion and to perform religious music as part of the curriculum, provided that religious practices are not endorsed.

Whitehead says that overly cautious approaches to mentioning Christ in Christmas celebrations has meant that "in the name of offending no one, you now have high school kids who can't play music that's part of the culture, and store clerks who are afraid to say, 'Merry Christmas.' It takes a joyous and merry day and just makes it blah."

Sandra Snowden agrees. According to papers she filed in a federal lawsuit, the resident of Bay Harbor Islands, Fla., was "offended" that the town allowed a menorah, but not a Nativity scene, to be placed along a public causeway.

When she protested, court papers say, town leaders countered that the menorah, which commemorates the rededication of the Temple in Jerusalem after a Jewish military victory in 165 B.C., was a secular symbol of freedom.

Before a federal judge ruled in her favor, Snowden rejected the town's offer to install a Christmas tree rather than a Nativity scene, which the town officials had called "divisive."

Those seeking to put more Christ into Christmas have had other successes.

In Mustang, Okla. on Dec. 14, parents incensed that a Nativity sequence had been dropped from a school holiday program organized to help defeat an $11 million school bond referendum.

And in Washington state, cake maker Julie West is claiming a small victory.

Although her son's teacher expressed some misgivings, West served slices of her "Happy Birthday Jesus" cake to 20 first-graders and about five other parents. No one complained, she says.

"I had gotten a legal opinion from the Rutherford Institute saying I was within my rights before I brought the cake to school," West says. "That's Christmas this year, I guess: candy cane frosting and a legal opinion."

**RichD** · 12-08-2011, 04:22 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Although her son's teacher expressed some misgivings, West served slices of her "Happy Birthday Jesus" cake to 20 first-graders and about five other parents. No one complained, she says.</div></div>

maybe she could have done this long ago...maybe she should have continued to say Merry Christmas all along.

**KleenBaggy** · 12-08-2011, 04:24 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

Coming out of the UK - Should the Christian religious festival of Christmas be celebrated in public? Or should we be careful to avoid giving offence to those of other faiths, or of no faith, at this time of year?

A GLOBAL ISSUE - Click here for an INTERESTING discussion

**KleenBaggy** · 12-08-2011, 04:34 PM

Re: Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

<span style="font-weight: bold">•School bus drivers ordered to remove festive decorations</span>

TORONTO SUN Link

KINGSTON, Ont. — All Diane Pope and Brigette Klepy want for Christmas is to be allowed to decorate the school buses they drive.

But an e-mail from Tri-Board Student Transportation Services has told them they're not allowed.

Klepy, who has been a bus driver for 15 years, said the children on her route love the decorations.

“These kids can't wait to get on the bus and see what I've done, to see what hat I'm wearing,” Klepy said.

In the e-mail to Klepy's employer, Stover Bus Line, Brenda Chalk, a transportation supervisor with Tri-Board, the transportation agency contracted to provide services for local school boards, said using a bus with Christmas decorations will not be allowed.

“If that bus is decorated tomorrow, it is not to leave your yard,” the email stated. “Another bus will need to be used on that route.

“Should the decorated bus be used on the route, it would be considered a breach of your contract,” the email concluded.

Klepy said she would remove the decorations prior to driving Wednesday morning.

She said she did not want Stover Bus Lines to lose its contract. Stover has a fleet of about 13 buses and is contracted to run about five school bus routes.

“If I leave the yard tomorrow, he loses his contract,” said a tearful Klepy.

“A couple of old ladies who want to decorate their buses and they are threatening to take away all his runs.”

The decorations on the inside of Klepy's bus were difficult to see from the outside. The ribbons, bows, snowflakes and Christmas crackers were fixed to the ceiling.

The bus Pope drives had stickers of snowmen, elves, Santa Claus and angels in the windows.

“I've been told I have to take all of that down,” Pope said.

“As a Canadian, I have celebrated Christmas all my life.”

Pope and Klepy said they would like to see the decoration ban abolished.

In a memo this month to bus operators, Tri-Board reminded drivers that “no seasonal decorations are to be placed on the inside or the outside of the school buses.”

The policy has been around for many years, Chalk said.

“We transport students from a variety of ethnic and religious groups,” Chalk said in an interview Tuesday afternoon.

“We like to keep it as generic as possible.”

According to the company's website, Tri-Board transports about 32,500 students to 160 schools.

Pope and Klepy said their decorations were non-denominational.

“This is totally not a religious thing. This is about Christmas,” said Klepy.

If anything, the decorations during the lead up to the Christmas break gives bus drivers a chance to connect with students and gives drivers a chance to show students their festive side, said Pope, who has been a bus driver for five years.

“It's the one time of year when we get to give back,” Pope said. “We discipline the kids all year long. This lets them see us in a different light.

“I don't see how a sticker on a window, or wearing a Christmas hat would offend anyone.

“I'm not trying to offend anyone.”

Thank God It's CHRISTMAS again!

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