Questions for the christians

**heretic** · 07-01-2008, 08:25 AM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do I want to go to hell? No
Do I want to avoid hell? Yes
Do I serve God simply for that reason? No

So Why PDB? Well my name kinda says it all. Purpose-Driven Bredda - I know why I'm here and because it is wrapped up in God, I seek to do what He wants me to do. That's why I do what I do. I try to make sure that everything that I do contributes positively to what my purpose is. That's why I serve the Lord. That's why I'm Christian......and hey, the benefits ain't that bad either!!! </div></div>
I noticed you ignored the other half of the equation. Would you still be so wrapped up in god if he didn't bribe you?

Plainly: If there were no threat of hell or promise of eternal life or promise earthly rewards, would you still follow the principles of the Bible and do what god (supposedly) wants you to do?

**WorshipRaiser** · 07-01-2008, 09:08 AM

Re: Questions for the christians

The primary reason for accepting the Lord into my life was to avoid hell. But as I learned and developed a deeper relationship with Him, I realized that there was more to it than that. Instead of approaching it, and paying attention to what I SHOULDN'T or COULDN'T do, I focus on what I SHOULD and what I CAN.

Why are you assuming that I deliberately ignored the second half a de question? Never assume my friend - assumptions are based on neither truth nor fact. I shall go up a top and look for the second part a de question.

**WorshipRaiser** · 07-01-2008, 09:13 AM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Newtriment</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
My second question is this.....if the "eternal life" clause was taken out the equation,..would you honestly be as robust in your adherence to christianity,....if it was proven beyond all doubt that when you die you stay dead,....no ressurection,no afterlife,no milk and honey,....would you still pursue your faith with the same fervour...?

</div></div>

Okay so that's like asking, if I really wasn't gonna get a degree after the 120 some odd credits, would I even bother going to school? The thing here is that, the law of sowing and reaping whether Biblical or not applies to everything. It's as universal as you can get. So, even though your question is valid, it's....what's the word? Let's just say this, what you sow, you gwine reap.

Glory to God.

**heretic** · 07-01-2008, 09:51 AM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The primary reason for accepting the Lord into my life was to avoid hell. But as I learned and developed a deeper relationship with Him, I realized that there was more to it than that. Instead of approaching it, and paying attention to what I SHOULDN'T or COULDN'T do, I focus on what I SHOULD and what I CAN.</div></div>That's all well and good, but it's not what I asked. What I asked was "If there were no threat of hell or promise of eternal life or promise earthly rewards, would you still follow the principles of the Bible and do what god (supposedly) wants you to do?". It's a pretty straightforward question.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why are you assuming that I deliberately ignored the second half a de question? Never assume my friend - assumptions are based on neither truth nor fact. I shall go up a top and look for the second part a de question. </div></div>You are assuming that I assumed. I merely made an observation and asked a question based on that observation.

**heretic** · 07-01-2008, 10:01 AM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay so that's like asking, if I really wasn't gonna get a degree after the 120 some odd credits, would I even bother going to school?</div></div>This is a perfectly reasonable question. I'd wager most people would not bother with school where it not for the degree at the end of the line and the associated potential for economic advancement.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The thing here is that, the law of sowing and reaping whether Biblical or not applies to everything. It's as universal as you can get. So, even though your question is valid, it's....what's the word? Let's just say this, what you sow, you gwine reap.</div></div>Not a ting go like dis.

Look around you, the wicked prosper and reap success all the time. The righteous reap suffering all the time. A man just took on a job to clean up the JUTC for $1 in annual pay - look how well that turned out for him and his family. You do not always reap what you sow in this life. It sucks, but that's reality of it. The Biblical approach to resolving this is to promise that you will 'eventually' reap what you sow, if not in this life, then in the next. This promise is particularly attractive to the weak, poor, downtrodden and uneducated (and probably why they are religious in greater than average percentages).

That's the basis of Newtribun's question: If you take that away would christians still be christians.

What's interesting to me is not that people are bribed or threatened into doing things (this is, after all, human nature), but that so many are so uncomfortable with admitting "i'm in this church business because of what I can get out of it".

**Compry** · 07-01-2008, 12:41 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

Good day heretic. Trusting all is well with you and yours.

I personally read the initial post and my first reaction was, "bait". I thought there was absolutely nothing that I could post that would be accepted as truth by the topic starter and the usual posters who show up in these types of thread.

I see folks in here speaking on behalf of Christians and drawing their own conclusions. Compry cannot speak on behalf of any other Christian primarily because it is a fact that we all come to Christ at different stages in our lives and for different reasons. Personally I was born into the church...I've said this here several times. Meaning, my aunt Rose (rest in peace) brought me to church ever since I was a baby and so my going to church was not because of the hell, fire and brimstone preaching. I grew up in the church and I honestly liked being in the church.

I migrated to Canada in my early teens to parents who were not churchgoers. I felt a major void and my mom seeing that I needed to go to church not out of fear but out of genuine desire, allowed me to visit my aunt's church. I was a Baptist in Jamaica so she thought it fitting to send me to another Baptist Church. I later found another church and was baptized by age 16.

I can truly tell you that a fear of hell or a need to go to heaven was never a driving factor for me. I had a pure love for the church. THEN....as I continued to mature physically and spiritually, after a very rough period in my life, I discovered that I needed to move to the next level. I needed to develop a relationship with God.

I will forever be grateful, despite how life turned out, to a former best friend who started me on the road to developing that relationship. Still after all these years, my desire to be the best I can be, to continue growing and being who He (God) wants me to be in Kingdom, has not faded. This desire is out of love...nothing else.

There is something amazing about having the love of the Christian God in your heart. I don't serve Him out of fear. I do it out of love for Him and His people. The Bible says in John 3:16-17, paraphrasing...For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son that whosoever (anyone) who believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world but that the world through Him would be saved.

It really is seeing the glass as half full or half empty...am I going to study to get my degree so I can live a prosperous life now? Have the education and knowledge to do the things I need to do now or am I just going to waste several years of study to end up with a degree? Kinda silly if the latter is chosen isn't it? Look at the possibilities and perks that comes with having the knowledge gained to get that degree.

What is my point after this long drawn out thing? While some may have chosen to be Christians because of the end results, that's not right. Personally, I didn't. I really do love the life that I chose to live.

God bless.

**neutral** · 07-01-2008, 01:13 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Compray</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I personally read the initial post and my first reaction was, "bait". </div></div>

Who me!..bait !...?

No cus compray,...yu got me wrong,....Thanks for your response,can you explain this bit to me...

"<span style="font-weight: bold"> For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son that whosoever (anyone) who believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world but that the world through Him would be saved.</span>"

Somewhere in there is a contradiction....he sent his son into the world that the world through him would be saved,(saved from what cus comp),....and yet it also imply that only those who believe in him will escape being perished.

So would you say in effect he didnt send his son to save the world,..he sent him to save only those who believed that he existed,...so how can someone be penalised for not believing something........its like a magician sending his assistant in the audience to kill all who doesnt believe in the illusion,..but spare those who did,...while telling them all he`s there to "save" them....you get what I`m getting at compray.

**WorshipRaiser** · 07-01-2008, 01:58 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heretic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The primary reason for accepting the Lord into my life was to avoid hell. But as I learned and developed a deeper relationship with Him, I realized that there was more to it than that. Instead of approaching it, and paying attention to what I SHOULDN'T or COULDN'T do, I focus on what I SHOULD and what I CAN.</div></div>That's all well and good, but it's not what I asked. What I asked was "If there were no threat of hell or promise of eternal life or promise earthly rewards, would you still follow the principles of the Bible and do what god (supposedly) wants you to do?". It's a pretty straightforward question.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why are you assuming that I deliberately ignored the second half a de question? Never assume my friend - assumptions are based on neither truth nor fact. I shall go up a top and look for the second part a de question. </div></div>You are assuming that I assumed. I merely made an observation and asked a question based on that observation. </div></div>

I can't imagine that there isn't a heaven or hell dude cause there is. It's like saying, man, suppose I was in Jamaica, I would have been........no! Mi stop think like that cause I ain't in Jamaica and that's fact.

**WorshipRaiser** · 07-01-2008, 02:03 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heretic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay so that's like asking, if I really wasn't gonna get a degree after the 120 some odd credits, would I even bother going to school?</div></div>This is a perfectly reasonable question. I'd wager most people would not bother with school where it not for the degree at the end of the line and the associated potential for economic advancement.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The thing here is that, the law of sowing and reaping whether Biblical or not applies to everything. It's as universal as you can get. So, even though your question is valid, it's....what's the word? Let's just say this, what you sow, you gwine reap.</div></div>Not a ting go like dis.

Look around you, the wicked prosper and reap success all the time. The righteous reap suffering all the time. A man just took on a job to clean up the JUTC for $1 in annual pay - look how well that turned out for him and his family. You do not always reap what you sow in this life. It sucks, but that's reality of it. The Biblical approach to resolving this is to promise that you will 'eventually' reap what you sow, if not in this life, then in the next. This promise is particularly attractive to the weak, poor, downtrodden and uneducated (and probably why they are religious in greater than average percentages).

That's the basis of Newtribun's question: If you take that away would christians still be christians.

What's interesting to me is not that people are bribed or threatened into doing things (this is, after all, human nature), but that so many are so uncomfortable with admitting "i'm in this church business because of what I can get out of it".
</div></div>

So what I think you should do is leff people alone who think and believe that they believe. Even the Bible talks about leaving someone alone if an argument develops about Christ and Christianity. Leff wi alone mek we gwan den nuh? A coulda wah suh? When Jesus comes back we will all see what will happen. Dude, no stress yuself. It's all good.

The Bible says that Jesus Death to the Jews didn't mek sense, and to the Greek was just pure bologna (balony). So hey, dat nuh change de fact seh Him did dead and raise? Leff de Christian dem mek dem believe weh dem believe men. Mi nuh run unu dung erday a try persuade unu.

**heretic** · 07-01-2008, 02:19 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heretic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The primary reason for accepting the Lord into my life was to avoid hell. But as I learned and developed a deeper relationship with Him, I realized that there was more to it than that. Instead of approaching it, and paying attention to what I SHOULDN'T or COULDN'T do, I focus on what I SHOULD and what I CAN.</div></div>That's all well and good, but it's not what I asked. What I asked was "If there were no threat of hell or promise of eternal life or promise earthly rewards, would you still follow the principles of the Bible and do what god (supposedly) wants you to do?". It's a pretty straightforward question.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why are you assuming that I deliberately ignored the second half a de question? Never assume my friend - assumptions are based on neither truth nor fact. I shall go up a top and look for the second part a de question. </div></div>You are assuming that I assumed. I merely made an observation and asked a question based on that observation. </div></div>

I can't imagine that there isn't a heaven or hell dude cause there is. It's like saying, man, suppose I was in Jamaica, I would have been........no! Mi stop think like that cause I ain't in Jamaica and that's fact.

</div></div>So your brain can't handle hypotheticals. Most curious.

**heretic** · 07-01-2008, 02:21 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So what I think you should do is leff people alone who think and believe that they believe. Even the Bible talks about leaving someone alone if an argument develops about Christ and Christianity. Leff wi alone mek we gwan den nuh? A coulda wah suh? When Jesus comes back we will all see what will happen. Dude, no stress yuself. It's all good.

The Bible says that Jesus Death to the Jews didn't mek sense, and to the Greek was just pure bologna (balony). So hey, dat nuh change de fact seh Him did dead and raise? Leff de Christian dem mek dem believe weh dem believe men. Mi nuh run unu dung erday a try persuade unu. </div></div>Drop the persecution complex. Nobody is molesting you and your beliefs. If you wanted to 'gwaan' you could have avoided the thread. People can discuss without persuading the other to change belief, or is that too hard to grasp?

Some things never change around here... Mi wi lef yu an yu beliefs mek unnu gwaan

**heretic** · 07-01-2008, 02:25 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

Morning, Compry. We are well. You?

**Shine_Eye_Girl** · 07-01-2008, 05:00 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

This whole thread is really something else.

Why is it so hard to fathom that someone can actually believe in God or a higher power? I respect everyone and their opinion regarding religion, but why all the crazy questions? The non believers seem to be searching for holes......but why?

You have your reason in believing there is no God, and they have their reason (solid proof as well) in believing there is a God.

**neutral** · 07-01-2008, 05:05 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

I didnt know you were a christian TLC,..thanks for your input,...not quite on topic but appreciated anyway.

**Shine_Eye_Girl** · 07-01-2008, 05:17 PM

Re: Questions for the christians

I'm not a Christian....you're welcome.

While my comment was not on topic, it was appropriate.

Questions for the christians

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