Another reason I am not a Christian

[Fledgist]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by servant:
[qb]And let it also be clear that there is no Christian doctrine or creed that required followers of the Christian faith to "shove people into 'showers' filled with cyanic gas", as a part of the practice of that faith. And let it also be clear that these are evil acts for which there is no justification inside or outside of Christianity.[/qb]

Let's be clear that 19 centuries of active Christian anti-Semitism, such as the treating of Jews as 'Christ-killers' led to this. And that you are doing your best to avoid acknowledging that.

Let's also be clear, btw, on how your ancestors and mine got to be Christians, a question that you keep avoiding. Let's also be clear on the Biblical position on the institution of slavery, shall we? That is unspeakably evil. Do you denounce it? Or do you share this utterly disgusting viewpoint: http://news.christiansunite.com/reli...ion02855.shtml

[servant]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

"Let's be clear that 19 centuries of active Christian anti-Semitism, such as the treating of Jews as 'Christ-killers' led to this."

Would anyone here care to speculate on why a social scientist, and a college professor to boot, would characterise the reasons for the rise of the Third Reich in such grossly simplistic terms ?

[Fledgist]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by servant:
[qb]"Let's be clear that 19 centuries of active Christian anti-Semitism, such as the treating of Jews as 'Christ-killers' led to this."

Would anyone here care to speculate on why a social scientist, and a college professor to boot, would characterise the reasons for the rise of the Third Reich in such grossly simplistic terms ?[/qb]

You're ducking the issue, o dishonest one. And avoiding the other issues I raised. But then what else would one expect? If you want I'll post anti-Semitic statements from Christian divines, such as Luther to refresh your memory.

(To cite 19 centuries of Christian anti-Semitism is 'simplistic'? Pull the other one.)

Again: How were black Jamaicans Christianised? Why are you having a hard time answering this question?

[LadyDayshah]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

There is evil everywhere.

Why do ppl. consistently find fault with others when they have their own faults????Dig up your own garbage and see...................

BTW-There may be no famous evil Buddhist,but come on we know they are out there.

to imagine that someone wants the actual name of one
lol. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[LadyDayshah]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by Fledgist:
[qb]Again: How were black Jamaicans Christianised? Why are you having a hard time answering this question?[/qb]

You answer the question please. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] And then tell us how Jamaicans became atheists. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] Perhaps u can throw in info. also on how Jamaicans became members of another religion/denomination while your at it.

[rebelgirl]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]There is evil everywhere.[/qb]

Yes true

Why do ppl. consistently find fault with others when they have their own faults????Dig up your own garbage and see...................

i think it is best for all of us to examine our faults, then we can work on ridding ourselves of them. If we refuse to acknowledge or constantly try and hide them than we are allowing history to repeat itself indefinitely. Kind like the kiddy fondling priests we all know this has been going on for a very long time, but it has always been denied and hidden, so it continued. now that it is out in the open it provides the opportunity for greater scrutiny and action to be taken to prevent it from happening on such a wide scale in the future.

[qb] BTW-There may be no famous evil Buddhist,but come on we know they are out there. [/qb]

Do we?

Yes as pointed out by my darling Esrand, I have a bleak view of humanity so I believe that they are. As pointed out by fledge Myanmar is definitely working on creating a Buddhist backed genocide. but it's not as common as it is with other religious dogma's. One reason could be the extreme non violence of the Buddhist religion. There are no scriptures or Tenants that one can use to excuse genocide or slavery.

[qb]to imagine that someone wants the actual name of one
lol. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [/qb]

absolutely i believe in truth and knowledge even if it makes my belief look bad . as i said denial only allows negative things to continue uninhibited. i claim no moral high ground i am a human and i know what we are all capable of , it's only our knowledge of our own nature that will allow us to learn to overcome it, or at least suppress the bad parts. Buddhist Christian Muslim atheist. Our books and philosophies only reflect who we are as a species, good and bad.

[LadyDayshah]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

[QUOTE]Originally posted by rebel:
[qb]

[qb]to imagine that someone wants the actual name of one
lol. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [/qb]

absolutely i believe in truth and knowledge even if it makes my belief look bad . as i said denial only allows negative things to continue uninhibited. i claim no moral high ground i am a human and i know what we are all capable of , it's only our knowledge of our own nature that will allow us to learn to overcome it, or at least suppress the bad parts. Buddhist Christian Muslim atheist. Our books and philosophies only reflect who we are as a species, good and bad.[/qb]

ok.

[rebelgirl]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]ok.[/qb]

Sure

[LadyDayshah]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by rebel:
[qb]

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]ok.[/qb]

Sure[/qb]

[img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[rebelgirl]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]

Originally posted by rebel:
[qb]

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]ok.[/qb]

Sure[/qb]

[img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] [/qb]

Exactly!

Meaning your OK was a little [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] as well, hence I answered with a synonym for ok

[LadyDayshah]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by rebel:
[qb]

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]

Originally posted by rebel:
[qb]

Originally posted by LadyDayshah:
[qb]ok.[/qb]

Sure[/qb]

[img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] [/qb]

Exactly!

Meaning your OK was a little [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] as well, hence I answered with a synonym for ok[/qb]

are u being nice??? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[rebelgirl]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

I think I am. I'm not trying to be mean, and I have no malicious intent if that's what your wondering. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by servant:
[qb]"Let's be clear that 19 centuries of active Christian anti-Semitism, such as the treating of Jews as 'Christ-killers' led to this."

Would anyone here care to speculate on why a social scientist, and a college professor to boot, would characterise the reasons for the rise of the Third Reich in such grossly simplistic terms ?[/qb]

What are you saying here?
The rise of the Third Reich took the persecution of the Jews to new levels, but persecution of the Jews was not the central piller of National Socialism.

Christian-Europe was already marginalizing the Jews as Fledge pointed out for 19 centuries long. The 12th Century and the epoch of the Black Plague saw more accusations against Jews and confining them to Ghettos. These were conditions already existing during Hilter and the National Socialists Rise to power, which was facilated by the bungling of the Allied Countries and the League of Nations after WW1.

[britisha]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

Originally posted by Fledgist:
[QB]

Originally posted by britisha:
[qb]

Originally posted by Fledgist:
... you could tell us of a genocide committed by black Africans who were uninfluenced by Christianity or Islam.

The fact that you didn't hear of it or know of it, doesn't mean that it couldn't have happened.

{Fledgist: True. However, do you have evidence of such a thing? If you do present it, if not my statement stands.}

You know, Fledgist, you surprise me. I am still wondering what do you wish to achieve by starting threads like these. You have informed the board of your qualifications which I am imagining that you achieved by your ability to be analytical. However to constantly harp on why you are not a christian, giving examples of warmongers and criminals who call themselves christians, as the reason why you couldn't embrace christianity make me seriously wonder what is up your sleeve.

{Fledgist: My arm.}

britisha: Now,now. You forgot the icon or graemlin; or are you afraid if you smile, your face will crack? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

You even go as far as to say: "If I do something bad, that could well be because I have not fully shaken off the influence of Christianity." Now I am here wondering how can anyone in their right mind make a statement as that? You sound like another poster here, who only saw things from the gloom and doom aspect.

{Fledgist: But you're not saying I'm wrong? If you have actual evidence -- other than the fact that I don't share your belief system -- that I'm not in my right mind, be so kind as to present it.}

britisha: Fledgist you are the one who time and time again refuse to accept that the Bible can affect you for the simple reason that you don't believe anything in it other than the historical accounts. So tell me, aren't you contradicting yourself? In addition to the fact that you stated that the Bible is not the foundation of morality (to which I agree)

Did you only read the parts of the Bible that dealt with war?

{Fledgist: I've read all of the Bible.}

You are seeing things through your own eyes, and others vice versa. The fact that you choose to focus on the negatives in the Bible, doesn't negate the positives that lie therein.

{Fledgist: Like the parts about slaves obeying their masters, perhaps? Or the only black people getting a favourable mention being eunuchs? And do tell me whose eyes I should see with?}

[Hahaha, [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] Use the icons, man. Not to belabor a worn out frazzled point, why is it that you never addressed slavery in Africa, past and present in the context of having nothing to with the Bible? Why not?]

Noone knows the true situation that existed in a former colony where artificial boundaries were set up, where tribes were pitted against tribes by former colonial masters who are well known for dividing and conquering and the years of indoctrination that could've gone on.

{Fledgist: Thanks for making my point.}

I hope it concurs with mine. Don't let the word "indoctrination" fool you. Indoctrination in terms of material wealth supercedes love and in the name of capitalism, it is good to kill our brother...nothing to do with religion. It is called again, dividing and conquering.

[The question should be, or one of the questions should be: "why are black ppl still killing each other as we speak both within and without Mother Africa?" What legacy did they inherit and from who would permit these sorts of mass murders to wantonly be perpetrated to this day? This is what we as a people on the other side of the diaspora should be focusing on...and no, you don't need my permission...instead of wasting our time talking about who is christian and who is not, and what christians do and don't. This is an exercise in futility.]

{Fledgist: If you want to stick your head in the sand, you're free to do so. Don't expect me to.}
britisha: Call it what you will. If you choose to spend the rest of your days, discussing religion, in the vein that you do...be my guest. IMHO there are more pressing problems in the Motherland than to tunnelvision my vision on floggin a dead horse sic, that is already dead.

[Who supplied the guns and ammunitions that we use to kill each other? Tribalism is an age-old phenomenon in Africa, and IMHO will not be eradicated easily. The white man saw this and capatalised on it, most likely why you and I are here today as we are, descendants of slaves....and still dividing and conquering. Look what happened in Sierra Leone, with children who can barely talk bearing ammunitons to shoot his brother. Again where did these ammo come from?]

{Fledgist: Tell us.}

How funny.

Whether or not we are or were christians in my opinion has nothing to do with this issue. Man is good and man has the propensity to be also evil. Religion or no religion, this is the fact, take it or leave it.

{Fledgist: Yet there's no evidence of such hostility or such horrible crimes before the arrival of Christianity.}

Where's the proof?

Wake up and smell the coffee, you are barking up the wrong tree.

Walk good.

So I'm a coffee-drinking dog?

Thanks for the ice-breaker.

[jedi]

Re: Another reason I am not a Christian

quote: Fledgist
Another reason I am not a Christian

I missed the first reason, since I came on here later than you, or perhaps you didn't share it could you please share that with us?