Portmore Boycott...

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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As to pit toilet the GOJ has been the foremost providers of Pit Toilets, in fact Dr. Clueless the Minister of Finance boasted that he had facilitated the building of pit toliets in his constituency as part of the improvement to the community, this is in Lower St. Andrew which is just than a mile from the Kingston Harbour.

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awww hellsno...Pit Tilet ? ...lower St. Andrew ?....mi think dem things deh did only deh a country....improvement to the community [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

a which part of St Andrew this deh ? bway mi really need fi read the gleaner more often....unless the recipient used to guh inna bush...then this is nothing fi him boast bout...

geezas saviah....

why ...oh why...is all this going on still....mi head a hat mi....

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In the capital city of Kingston and in the tourist capital Montego Bay, people are still using pit latrines (many of which are full to the brim), while others use "Lada bags" to parachute their excrement into clogged gullies and overgrown bushes. This is occurring in a country where the ruling party which has been in power since 1989 is insisting that it is the best choice for Jamaica.

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The politics of deception

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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awww hellsno...Pit Tilet ? ...lower St. Andrew ?....mi think dem things deh did only deh a country....improvement to the community [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

a which part of St Andrew this deh ? bway mi really need fi read the gleaner more often....unless the recipient used to guh inna bush...then this is nothing fi him boast bout...

geezas saviah....

why ...oh why...is all this going on still....mi head a hat mi....

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In Jamaica's case we have had sufficient resources over the past 30 years to have made a significant dent on poverty but much of the money, especially over the past 13 years when the level of borrowing increased from about $10 billion to $500 billion, has either been wasted or the government failed to give priority to poverty. The multi-billion dollar 2000 super highway being built from Kingston to Montego Bay cannot, under any circumstances, be considered a priority at this time when thousands live with hogs and goats in the ghettos and there are 6,000 basic schools still using pit latrines 40 years after independence. I do not think the highway should go beyond the first phase. The much-heralded Poverty Alleviation Programme touches just a spec of the poverty

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Heroes of the ghettos

[niceniss]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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Mandeville has distance and unlike Portmore, it is not considered to be a part of the kingston metropolitan region, hence the availability of facilities in mandeville.

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when since is it considered part of the Kingston metro area?

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since it is.

question: did you know that portmore was built as a dorm community for kingston? it is only 10 minutes outside of kingston.

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yes however administratively it is part of st cathrine...is hat inaccurate?


or yuh juslike to sey dat a kingston yuh come from rather dan st cathrine [img]/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

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even though I was born in Kingston I wouldnt boast about it.
I'm only stating the facts here...

[niceniss]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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BTW, Donnika, me notice yuh ignore my last questions to you. Gov't do not request taxes and fees, the impose/levy them.

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The people of portmore paid taxes for the causeway bridge, in fact the first residence of portmore paid for the bridge separately from their mortgages so taking away what was paid for and giving it to a french company isnt the same as "paying taxes". it is highway robbery. literally!

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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Dis mek me [img]/forums/images/graemlins/704555_dwl.gif[/img] Why unno must always paint every single body in JA as a sufferah? Dem poor likkle impoverished people living on the tiny island in the caribbean.

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Not guilty!

By: Indi Mclymont, Journalist, Panos Institute
Tue Sep 20, 2005
Communities unite for better sanitation


Janet Stewart showing one of the pit toilets

Kingston, 18 September 2005 (Panos) - Janet Stewart’s face beams with pride as she shows off a newly constructed pit toilet in the small coastal community of Botany Bay, St. Thomas, Jamaica. She is one of the community workers who worked with the Whitehorses, Botany Bay and Pamphret Development Benevolent Society to get pit latrines for some community members who had none.

“See another one over there so,” she says pointing across the road at another small wooden building. The pit toilet she displays is immaculately kept. The floor is clean and there is no smell. Eleven persons in Botany Bay were provided with pit latrines. A total of 30 were distributed in the three communities between last November and March 2005.

“At first the people were skeptical. Some of them were ashamed to admit that they did not have any toilet,” says Stewart, who has also been trained by the Benevolent society as a Water, Sanitation and Hygiene (WASH) promoter in the community. “We asked the persons getting the toilets to pick up the material, which we gave them, and provide the labour. We supervised.”

Each pit latrine, she says, cost an average of $58,000 (approximately US$950) including labour costs.

“The Benevolent Society went out and did a needs assessment of the communities. We wanted to find out what was most urgent. Sanitation was high on the list and we eventually identified areas that we called hot spots,” Stewart explained. “Those were homes without toilet facilities but with vulnerable groups like many children, pregnant mothers and the elderly.”

Having their sanitation needs met has resulted in an increased awareness of health and sanitation issues in the community. There has also been a change of attitude.

“People are no longer ashamed to say that they don’t have toilets. Now they will see you and ask “yuh have any more toilet?” says Stewart, who was giving a quick tour of the sanitation solutions during a break in another training course being put on by the Benevolent society in mid August 2005.

This time, she is one of 24 persons from the three communities, who will be trained in promoting behaviour change in sanitation practices.

“This training is geared towards helping people to believe in themselves and their communities,” said President of the Benevolent society, Leonard James.

“The Society was formed to help build leaders in the community so that you can contribute in a positive way. Our community is rated on the lowest quartile of the poverty map so there is a lot to be done. The training will make you part of the decision-makers in the community and not part of the problem,” James told the participants at the start of the first three days of training at the Botany Bay Community Centre earlier this month.

The group will be taught about the formation of attitudes and behaviour. They will be given two weeks to go into the communities to identify and collect information about attitudes that impact sanitation in the community. Then in September they will be trained for another three days.

“After that training they will be expected to come up with plans to target those behaviours and we will monitor them as they implement them,” says Desmalee Holder-Neivins, the trainer. She works with the Department of Community Health and Psychiatry at the University of the West Indies.

The training is part of an ongoing project, collaborative effort between the Ministry of Water and Housing, Ministry of Health, Social Development Commission, the Coalition for Community Participation in Governance, the Environmental Foundation of Jamaica, Habitat for Humanity, the US Agency for International Development (USAID), the Peace Corps and the Caribbean Environment Programme (UNEP/CEP).

From April 2004 to March 2005 USAID/CWIP contributed $2.4 million (approx. US$40,000) to the implementation of the project. UNEP/CEP has also contributed US$25,000 to the project a part of which will be used to build at least another 15 sanitation facilities.

The project started with a survey carried out by the Construction Resource and Development Centre (CRDC) to determine the sanitation conditions in the three communities. This revealed that 54 per cent of the households had latrines, 30 per cent had flush systems while ten per cent were without any sanitation solution.

A detailed needs assessment of 1044 households was subsequently done, covering issues such as income, size of household and existing sanitation characteristics. Eight hundred houses were assessed in White Horses, 178 in Botany Bay and 66 in Pamphret. It was decided that the neediest houses in each area would benefit from the project.

“Prior to the project, 10 per cent or 181 households in the communities were without sanitation solutions,” said Carmen Griffiths from CRDC. “Those households had to either use their neighbours toilet, which very often was inconvenient, or go with the preferred disposal method known as kiting.”

Kiting involves defecating in a plastic bag, which is then thrown away into the bush or gully etc. It is practises like these that are a risk to community health. According to a consultant on the project, Linnette Vassel, based on the success so far of the community interventions, the project will be modeled in other communities.

“The programme is based on a model that focuses on active participation of communities and the private sector in managing and maintaining sanitation systems. It complements other efforts to eliminate absolute poverty in rural communities,” she said. “This community has come a long way in the past two years ¦and we are going to replicate the training and activities in our rural water programmes in communities like Gravel Hill in Clarendon, Mile Gully and Warwick Castle in St Mary and another community in St Elizabeth.”

The replication of the project is also important to agencies like UNEP’s Caribbean Environment Programme.

“It definitely is a best practice demo and has the ability to be replicated elsewhere,” said UNEP/CEP programme officer, Christopher Corbin. “We were happy to be a part of the partnership because we think it is very important to be involved and bring about change at the community level. (END/Panos/180905)

Communities unite for better sanitation


It wasn't me!
The politics of deception

[Pepper]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

MR. Gong,

Global village and likkle village have two totally different connotations. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Pepper]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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BTW, Donnika, me notice yuh ignore my last questions to you. Gov't do not request taxes and fees, the impose/levy them.

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The people of portmore paid taxes for the causeway bridge, in fact the first residence of portmore paid for the bridge separately from their mortgages so taking away what was paid for and giving it to a french company isnt the same as "paying taxes". it is highway robbery. literally!

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No argument that they are paying and have paid property taxes. However, what makes you think the gov't should ASK them if they want to pay a toll? What logic yuh a follow?

[niceniss]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

[ QUOTE ]
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BTW, Donnika, me notice yuh ignore my last questions to you. Gov't do not request taxes and fees, the impose/levy them.

[/ QUOTE ]

The people of portmore paid taxes for the causeway bridge, in fact the first residence of portmore paid for the bridge separately from their mortgages so taking away what was paid for and giving it to a french company isnt the same as "paying taxes". it is highway robbery. literally!

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No argument that they are paying and have paid property taxes. However, what makes you think the gov't should ASK them if they want to pay a toll? What logic yuh a follow?

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quibbling over side points is not something I'm particularly interested in doing. However, it seem to me that you see absolutely nothing wrong with the imposition of tolls on a TAXPAID road.
as if what the people paid meant nothing and the causeway was the govt's to do whatever it pleased.

Interesting, but then you commented that nothing wrong with the people suffering like new yorkers do (equating a mountain with a molehill) [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[msportmore]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

mi jus type dis big ole long response an it gawn to neck back!!!! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

[ QUOTE ]
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BTW, Donnika, me notice yuh ignore my last questions to you. Gov't do not request taxes and fees, the impose/levy them.

[/ QUOTE ]

The people of portmore paid taxes for the causeway bridge, in fact the first residence of portmore paid for the bridge separately from their mortgages so taking away what was paid for and giving it to a french company isnt the same as "paying taxes". it is highway robbery. literally!

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No argument that they are paying and have paid property taxes. However, what makes you think the gov't should ASK them if they want to pay a toll? What logic yuh a follow?

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It is not merely property taxes, the first residents paid a separate levy for the Causeway Bridge and the entrance, egress to it.

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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MR. Gong,

Global village and likkle village have two totally different connotations. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Ms Peppa!

Let's quibble ova side points.
Even accepting what you said above, how did my reference to little village equate to saying all Jamaicans or any Jamaicans are sufferers?

[mountaingal]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

It seems to me that if in 2002 they were forseeing a $45J toll, then the $60J being charged now, accounting for devaluation, is in line - did ppl think the the original proposed rate was too high?

it's quite common for governments to strike deals with foreign companies for major infrastucture. there's a huge commotion now because in toronto, the city council decided NOT to entertain bids from a german company (which kind of makes my point in a backwards way). the bottom line is the trade-off in terms of which will cost taxpayers less.

does the government of jamaica or any jamaican company indeed have the money/project management skills to undertake big budget infrastructure? isn't it a common complaint that the government is incompetent in these areas?

as to the competing commuter thing, i think in the article i interpret some room for the government to create a rail service, as long as its not high-speed, but i'll wait for tuff gong's post later with specific references from the contract.

as i read this thread, i remember portmore's efforts to be considered a municipality, and all the local infrastructure trappings that entails, i find it a tad ironic that some protests are hanging on the idea of portmore as a bedroom community. if i were mayor, i'd use the toll road and what it implies to lobby instead for more locally situated main services, and more jobs in portmore. it really should not be that simply to go a road you have to drive to another municipality - life in portmore should involve spending time in portmore.

just my thoughts from 3,000 miles away from the situation and emotion. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Pepper]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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quibbling over side points is not something I'm particularly interested in doing. However, it seem to me that you see absolutely nothing wrong with the imposition of tolls on a TAXPAID road.
as if what the people paid meant nothing and the causeway was the govt's to do whatever it pleased.

Interesting, but then you commented that nothing wrong with the people suffering like new yorkers do (equating a mountain with a molehill) [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

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Me just ask yuh a question about your thought process. Call it quibbling if you like....just part of the course of discussion.

The people in Portmore are not special in any regards when it comes to being charged a toll. People all over the world, NYC, Canada, Singapore, UK, etc, pay property taxes and then turn around and pay tolls. People all over the world have daily struggles in life. If yuh live a Portmore, or Damascus, yuh gwine face tough times. And anybody who lives in a society with a government lives with the risk that one day a fee, a tax, or a toll may be imposed by said gov't. That is the reality of the world we live in.

Right now, is Portmore time fi deal wid it. Tomorrow will be someone else. People of Portmore nuh exempt from struggle. If dem nuh like what the Gov't do, thankfully they have the ability to vote out those who imposed the toll.

[mountaingal]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

did the taxes pay to build? did they address maintenance of the road once it was built? there's a difference.

here in toronto, nuff musings about toll roads also include some idea that they would help maintain road infrastructure and keep them in good repair.

[Pepper]

Re: Portmore Boycott...

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MR. Gong,

Global village and likkle village have two totally different connotations. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Ms Peppa!

Let's quibble ova side points.
Even accepting what you said above, how did my reference to little village equate to saying all Jamaicans or any Jamaicans are sufferers?

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LOL, thanks for the laugh.

When you refer to little village, what exactly do you mean? Last time I was in Portmore, it looked more like a thriving metropolis than a little village.