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Re: Jamaicans Abroad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JAminded</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
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Maybe one of the root cause Jaminded observe is Jamaicans think America is just a place to mek some money while some of the other immigrants think in more final terms and make home here..who knows </div></div>
Indeed the notion of lack of permanency to emigration is an interesting one and begs further inquiry as to how such a mindset could ultimately impact collective action.
I would have to conclude that a significant number of Caribbean immigrants--speaking anecdotally of those I encounter in the course of my work-- certainly not conclusions derived from any body of scientific work--operate from the perspective that their stay in America is less than permanent. Ironically, even some who have been in the US for decades. Many have not become citizens yet pay taxes, have children, own homes and business and yet have no vote or voice in the policies that govern their lives or the future of their children.
It was suggested in this string that language promotes unity among Haitians for example and explains, at least in part why Jamaicans might have difficulty uniting. The power of language as a balkanizing force is understandable and makes sense. However, it probably operates as a push factor for unity. But what about the pull factor of other aspects of a culture: music, dance, food, folklore, morals, values, etc. Why would language as a singular cultural influence outweigh all these even when taken collectively?
It was even suggest that collectivity might not be a vehicle to empowerment and even if Jamaicans garnered political and economic power…what would they do with it? I am not sure if this question was designed for levity but power gives people the ability to make changes favorable to their wellbeing.
I am of the notion that if the Jamaican Diaspora had real power where we live perhaps we could influence not only foreign policy toward the Island but impact the internal policies of Jamaica for the better.
Since I’m new to this board I am not sure if this discussion was placed in the proper forum. Is there is a desire to bring this string to a comedic end?
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Forgive me if I am judging all this wrongly, but somehow from the start I got the impression that this is written or the thread is started by someone who might be doing some research; but sort of dropped a "bait" to see how the boardies would respond...am I right?
In any case, I beg to differ with some of what you implied..
<span style="font-weight: bold">
It was suggested in this string that language promotes unity among Haitians for example and explains, at least in part why Jamaicans might have difficulty uniting. The power of language as a balkanizing force is understandable and makes sense. However, it probably operates as a push factor for unity. But what about the pull factor of other aspects of a culture: music, dance, food, folklore, morals, values, etc. Why would language as a singular cultural influence outweigh all these even when taken collectively?</span>
While language might be seen as a "unifying force" among Haitians...it is not a matter of them being UNIFIED by the language; as much as they are living out a circumstance as witnessed among other groups that one might say has a "language barrier" in the initial stage[s] of their migration...in other words, one could call it a "given.."
Again, it was not implied that it would outweigh all those other variables collectively...Inherent in the "language" are the values and mores that are indigenous to those people...you, as I stated earlier, left no room for a reasonable discussion, since you "limited" your scope, to only Brooklyn...You didn't include Africans who should be also IMHO be included in the equation....you could have mentioned them, and extrapolate from the responses...even if the focus is only on Jamaicans..
Anyway, your homepoint about Jamaicans influencing politics at home through concerted efforts, begs the question, for if you have been reading some of these threads and see the animosity shown, if you can call that as an analogy: that might explain why Jamaicans as far as *I* know/OBSERVE would abstain from such a undertaking...
..as for "power" and what would they do with it? You are talking about a "group" within the US of A...a great mosaic where we are all perceived as "equal", ie none having any more importance than the other under the Constitution...as for improving their "well being"...all people have to do is to take up the phone and phone their Senators/Congress people...you don't need a million people to do this, all that can do it is one phone call..
What you might need a million people to do is to vote against those who don't have the interest of the people at heart...all people. I don't also believe that any one group can influence "foreign policy" not even the Jews..
...and Jamaicans are doing good where helping at home is concerned...check the High School alumnae boards...for starters...btw your questions have taken on a scholarly approach, different from the initial outset...agen, are you conducting research???
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JAminded</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Maybe one of the root cause Jaminded observe is Jamaicans think America is just a place to mek some money while some of the other immigrants think in more final terms and make home here..who knows </div></div>
Indeed the notion of lack of permanency to emigration is an interesting one and begs further inquiry as to how such a mindset could ultimately impact collective action.
I would have to conclude that a significant number of Caribbean immigrants--speaking anecdotally of those I encounter in the course of my work-- certainly not conclusions derived from any body of scientific work--operate from the perspective that their stay in America is less than permanent. Ironically, even some who have been in the US for decades. Many have not become citizens yet pay taxes, have children, own homes and business and yet have no vote or voice in the policies that govern their lives or the future of their children.
It was suggested in this string that language promotes unity among Haitians for example and explains, at least in part why Jamaicans might have difficulty uniting. The power of language as a balkanizing force is understandable and makes sense. However, it probably operates as a push factor for unity. But what about the pull factor of other aspects of a culture: music, dance, food, folklore, morals, values, etc. Why would language as a singular cultural influence outweigh all these even when taken collectively?
It was even suggest that collectivity might not be a vehicle to empowerment and even if Jamaicans garnered political and economic power…what would they do with it? I am not sure if this question was designed for levity but power gives people the ability to make changes favorable to their wellbeing.
I am of the notion that if the Jamaican Diaspora had real power where we live perhaps we could influence not only foreign policy toward the Island but impact the internal policies of Jamaica for the better.
Since I’m new to this board I am not sure if this discussion was placed in the proper forum. Is there is a desire to bring this string to a comedic end?
</div></div>
Forgive me if I am judging all this wrongly, but somehow from the start I got the impression that this is written or the thread is started by someone who might be doing some research; but sort of dropped a "bait" to see how the boardies would respond...am I right?
In any case, I beg to differ with some of what you implied..
<span style="font-weight: bold">
It was suggested in this string that language promotes unity among Haitians for example and explains, at least in part why Jamaicans might have difficulty uniting. The power of language as a balkanizing force is understandable and makes sense. However, it probably operates as a push factor for unity. But what about the pull factor of other aspects of a culture: music, dance, food, folklore, morals, values, etc. Why would language as a singular cultural influence outweigh all these even when taken collectively?</span>
While language might be seen as a "unifying force" among Haitians...it is not a matter of them being UNIFIED by the language; as much as they are living out a circumstance as witnessed among other groups that one might say has a "language barrier" in the initial stage[s] of their migration...in other words, one could call it a "given.."
Again, it was not implied that it would outweigh all those other variables collectively...Inherent in the "language" are the values and mores that are indigenous to those people...you, as I stated earlier, left no room for a reasonable discussion, since you "limited" your scope, to only Brooklyn...You didn't include Africans who should be also IMHO be included in the equation....you could have mentioned them, and extrapolate from the responses...even if the focus is only on Jamaicans..
Anyway, your homepoint about Jamaicans influencing politics at home through concerted efforts, begs the question, for if you have been reading some of these threads and see the animosity shown, if you can call that as an analogy: that might explain why Jamaicans as far as *I* know/OBSERVE would abstain from such a undertaking...
..as for "power" and what would they do with it? You are talking about a "group" within the US of A...a great mosaic where we are all perceived as "equal", ie none having any more importance than the other under the Constitution...as for improving their "well being"...all people have to do is to take up the phone and phone their Senators/Congress people...you don't need a million people to do this, all that can do it is one phone call..
What you might need a million people to do is to vote against those who don't have the interest of the people at heart...all people. I don't also believe that any one group can influence "foreign policy" not even the Jews..
...and Jamaicans are doing good where helping at home is concerned...check the High School alumnae boards...for starters...btw your questions have taken on a scholarly approach, different from the initial outset...agen, are you conducting research???
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