So Barack ...

[Dyoll_73]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barack himself has done nothing wrong in fact he is to be congratualted for saving the economy of the USA and the world from total collaspe. He could not have created one more job. Government in the USA do not create jobs, it can only create the environment to enable business to grow and hire. that he has done.</div></div>

That the economy was pulled from the brink is not in dispute. However, the economy is expected to have net job loss as at December 2009. Businesses need capital in order to grow and hire, and banks aren't lending.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Where he has failed is within the Democratic Party. Hi failure proves what is fact of politics in the USA, the POTUS is virtually powerless if he cannot convince the all Party's Senators and Congressional representative to line up behind his policies and worse if he cannot convince a significant number of the Opposing Bench to go with him.

He has reached too far over to Republicans and failed and the Democrap Party true to itself has found a way to undermine and water down or just plain block every Policy initiatives that he has tried.
The problem is with the Democratic Party not the POTUS, </div></div>

So it's the centrists, as I've mentioned earlier. The thing is, what does it say about the POTUS if he surrounds himself with centrists within the executive branch, most notably Rahm, Tim, Larry, and Orszag? It seems to me to be a centrist executive branch meets a dominant centrist impulse in the legislative branch. What different result should be expected? You're also suggesting that he is naive. That's a failure.

[Tuff Gong]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Humano</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So it's the centrists, as I've mentioned earlier. The thing is, what does it say about the POTUS if he surrounds himself with centrists within the executive branch, most notably Rahm, Tim, Larry, and Orszag? It seems to me to be a centrist executive branch meets a dominant centrist impulse in the legislative branch. What different result should be expected? You're also suggesting that he is naive. That's a failure. </div></div>

You left out Geithner. I think it was two things he had always admired Billary Clinton and their Cabinets so naturally was dead set on getting them in as soon as he won. The second problem is he was battered and bruised coming out of the Primaries and the Presidential Elections and he could not take no chances on being too left, too black, too angry and too unknown. Those are unique set of problems facing him and he will have to overcome them by exerting his stamp on his Cabinet.

[Tuff Gong]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Humano</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barack himself has done nothing wrong in fact he is to be congratualted for saving the economy of the USA and the world from total collaspe. He could not have created one more job. Government in the USA do not create jobs, it can only create the environment to enable business to grow and hire. that he has done.</div></div>

That the economy was pulled from the brink is not in dispute. However, the economy is expected to have net job loss as at December 2009. Businesses need capital in order to grow and hire, and banks aren't lending.</div></div>

Can't force the banks to lend, this is a Capitalist economy. As the economy get better business persons burned by the collapse of the economy aren't necessarily going to run to hire staff. Rather they will try to consolidate and maximize what they have already, just in case the economy hits another trough.

Banks hit from all sides and do not trust business and surely will not risk money if it not going to bring returns. They can always bet on Gold, Oil and the few other staples that will guarantee them returns until the economy seems on a more sound footing. Remember there is all this Housing Paper and Consumer Credit out there and a day of reckoning will come.

[Dyoll_73]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...but that just a perception of Barack, he was a centrist from day one. He right of the Democratic Party on all issues except the conduct of the war in Iraq, Diplomacy and Social Programmes. </div></div>

You're right. He was not some liberal firebrand as some would project unto him. The fact is though, that a lot of people did, and the question is why? Were they simply not paying attention, being caught up in the euphoria, or they had some reason to think so?

To tell you the truth, I saw his centrism long before he even announced his candidacy. On the issue which garnered him strong support among progressives - his opposition to the Iraq war - I had started to wonder if had he been in the Senate if he would not have voted for war authorization as most dems did. It was useless speculation, but it was the way I thought given his overall centrist proclivities.

[Dyoll_73]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You left out Geithner.</div></div>

No, I did mentioned him as &quot;Tim.&quot;

[Tuff Gong]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Humano</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You left out Geithner.</div></div>

No, I did mentioned him as &quot;Tim.&quot;

</div></div>Sorry he is going to go soon anyway!

[Tuff Gong]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Humano</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You're right. He was not some liberal firebrand as some would project unto him. The fact is though, that a lot of people did, and the question is why?</div></div>

The Citizens of the USA, I am sorry to say, have been dumb about Politics since the late 60s. Vietnam and the Generation that came after created folks willing to believe anything and others who care about nothing in the way of electing good strong leaders. They have been led to believe the USA is is best thing since slice brad and that Government is the problem, so the less you hear about Government run/or directed programmes the better.

Using the words, taxes, big government, left leaning is like throwing raw meat to a pack of jackals a Democratic, Black Politician, who speak eloquently and comes from Illinois via exotic roots will never be able to shape his own image. I think the Obama Campaign did an excellent job against the Conventional Wisdom. Too bad the Right Wing closed their eyes too tight they could not see that he was less radical than they were led to believe.

[Dyoll_73]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Humano</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barack himself has done nothing wrong in fact he is to be congratualted for saving the economy of the USA and the world from total collaspe. He could not have created one more job. Government in the USA do not create jobs, it can only create the environment to enable business to grow and hire. that he has done.</div></div>

That the economy was pulled from the brink is not in dispute. However, the economy is expected to have net job loss as at December 2009. Businesses need capital in order to grow and hire, and banks aren't lending.</div></div>

Can't force the banks to lend, this is a Capitalist economy. </div></div>

Yeah, I understand that, but you did say earlier that he had created the conditions for businesses to grow and hire. If banks are pretty much sitting it out right now waiting for the economy to improve, I thought they would at least understand that their lending - with due diligence and prudence being exercised of course - is critical to the recovery effort, don't you think?

And in the meantime, those complex derivatives which, according to Nassim Taleb, &quot;no one understands&quot; continue under loopholes engineered by the bank lobby. You are right: a day of reckoning will come.

[Tuff Gong]

Re: So Barack ...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Humano</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yeah, I understand that, but you did say earlier that he had created the conditions for businesses to grow and hire. </div></div> He has but the banks don't believe because they know what they are sitting on. They can continue to bet and hold out while the housing and credit mes percolate. They are really not going to lend to one small business unless it is bullet proof.