What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

[MsPeaches]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama


Malcolm X has become a hero to me too since I came to Ghana. There have been several movies and documentaries about him on TV here and he was a truly great man, IMHO. I clearly remember the vitriolic tone of Time Magazine et al articles about him in his day. The propaganda and deliberate fear-mongering about him were really 'way over the line. He was a visionary who was ahead of his time, like Nkrumah and Lumumba.

What he would have thought about Obama?

I think he might have been happy he was elected but disappointed like the rest of us in his performance.

But you know something, Obama is really between a rock and a hard place: He's really just a puppet like other heads of governments these days.

[johnnycakes]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Emperah_dehyah</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MGee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">lookya dahjah, malcolm x is one of my heroes, and if he is one of yours, u would tek time before posting nonsense that purport to say that malcolm x would denounce barack.

everybody so bc ready fi talk fi mx when it comes to the us, but what about speculating about what mx would say about jihadists?

when he became an alhaji, mx became a great contextualist, and his world view lengthened. all this rc navelgazing and placing blame on the us alone without considering broader historical and contemporary issues is the last thing mx would have done, if we are to consider the consistency of his character.

where is the commentary and speculation that would have mx blasting bin laden and alquaeda in somalia and all those other places, doing murder in the name of islam?
</div></div>

Why do you believe he wouldn't denounce Obama?
He wasn't blinded by colour like it seems many have become.
Good works is good works and any ones administration weh jus a cyarry on de works of de last one cannot be seen as good.
And yes he would also be against those so-called muslims who a carry on de way some of these a gwaan. Mi nuh kno why yuh a mek dis hot yuh suh much, de real big question is why ppl jus a believe a man is so good jus cah him blk. </div></div>


Thank you very much Emperah-dehyah.

Malik would have called you an ally and friend.

I can't imagine what he would have called those who play along with the establishment and vote for those whose interests are not those of poor and working people and whose image they sully by saying they follow his teachings.

Well, yes I do know what he called them.

(see his &quot;ballots or bullets&quot; speech )

[Derek]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MGee</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why don't you factor in the power, reach and efficiency of these organisations?
I'm a little surprised.


And it's forbidden for men to dress up like women. </div></div>

history is replete with the failure of organizations, especially when they operate from hubris.

somehow, i doubt obl or any serious jihadist with a war mindset would care about a thing like wearing women's clothes, if in the end it serves a strategic purpose.

anyhoo, mi a bow out of this convo. </div></div>

Well I hope you don't bow out of this convo because, you're implying that, for TEN YEARS, the CIA couldn't find the man who killed 3,000 Americans because he was probably wearing women's clothing!


Yeah right!


They found Noriega and Saddam<span style="text-decoration: line-through">'s double</span> quickly enough - and they didn't kill any innocent Americans.



They couldn't find the guy because he was blasted dead.

[johnnycakes]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

A report I read said that the U.S has such good satellite surveillance equipment that had bin Laden been hiding in the caves, he would have been spotted by picking out any unusually tall (6'4&quot person against a delineating snowy background by his shadow.

The same report also said that because he needed medical care he had to be in a place with electricity medical facilities which is why he was where he was ( not because he knew he could be spotted so effectively and easily out in the boondocks)

[mountaingal]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Emperah_dehyah</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why do you believe he wouldn't denounce Obama?
He wasn't blinded by colour like it seems many have become.
Good works is good works and any ones administration weh jus a cyarry on de works of de last one cannot be seen as good.
And yes he would also be against those so-called muslims who a carry on de way some of these a gwaan. Mi nuh kno why yuh a mek dis hot yuh suh much, de real big question is why ppl jus a believe a man is so good jus cah him blk. </div></div>

to you dahjah and jah yout:

mi get hot, because to me, malcolm was a complex man, and would have applied more sophisticated thinking to the question of barack than what i've seen others try to apply in this thread (including in the original article).

there's no question that malcolm had incredible self-discipline and a strict code of belief and conduct. and that many things were to him simply right and wrong. but even so, he brought an understanding of larger forces and history that helped him in his judgment of individuals and causes.

imo, malcolm, when looking at barack, would take into account a bunch of things:
- <span style="font-weight: bold">barack is an intellectua</span>l black man, like malcolm himself was

- <span style="font-weight: bold">barack achieved financial independence</span> as an individual, which was one of the malcolm's most important tenets in his NOI days, because economic independence helped free a black man from subservience to a racist american system

- barack , a black man, a<span style="font-weight: bold">chieved the highest position in the USA</span> - which he achieved in part by drawing votes from across the racial spectrum <span style="font-weight: bold">WITHOUT denying his own racial heritage </span>as an American black man - that inner racial integrity is something i believe strongly malcolm would respect

- <span style="font-weight: bold">barack also has a strong moral code</span> - discernible from the campaign trail when he told his campaign folks &quot;family is out of bounds&quot; when everyone expected he would jeer at the palin teen's out-of-wedlock pregnancy. and, discernible also in the instructions he gave around the killing - yes - and disposal of obl.

i think that malcolm would have appreciated these characteristics in barack. <span style="font-weight: bold">they are essentially the same type of man.</span>

malcolm would have placed barack's character in context when assessing barack's performance in one of the toughest jobs in the world - even tougher for a black man: leader of a country that was in economic decline, still riven by racial hatred, and psychically wounded not just from 9/11 but from other signs that it no longer had the same force and stature in the world.

barack obama is juggling pressures at home and abroad, while fending off contempt and disrespect from both blacks and whites who choose to judge him through the prism of race. he's not doing enuf for blacks. he's only doing stuff cause he's black. he's too black. he's not black enuf.

barack obama carries the mantle of leadership easier than most people expected. he has compromised, yes, and not lived up to expectations that all had of him, because he's not superman, and he is not a dictator.

i think malcolm would have looked on this with admiration.

malcolm, even after becoming an alhaji, would have UNDERSTOOD barack's mission wrt to obl. the need to avenge american deaths - americans who were of all races and beliefs. malcolm would perhaps have disagreed with the manner.

but denouncing barack on the grounds of acting as other american leaders have done in the past - NO.

barack is not like any other american leader in the past, no matter how comforting it is to some to think the position of POTUS is some slot into which so-called puppeteers slide their latest marionette.

barack, from where i am (because i don't live in the us) is a man who knows himself - as a president, as a man, as a black man, as a husband, as a father. he is not perfect, but he is not cavalier. he makes tough decisions, and takes tough action, from a place of belief that he is doing the right thing for americans. <span style="font-weight: bold">he's not the leader of the world, he is the american leader</span>.

i think malcolm would have understood.

[mountaingal]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MGee</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why don't you factor in the power, reach and efficiency of these organisations?
I'm a little surprised.


And it's forbidden for men to dress up like women. </div></div>

history is replete with the failure of organizations, especially when they operate from hubris.

somehow, i doubt obl or any serious jihadist with a war mindset would care about a thing like wearing women's clothes, if in the end it serves a strategic purpose.

anyhoo, mi a bow out of this convo. </div></div>

Well I hope you don't bow out of this convo because, you're implying that, for TEN YEARS, the CIA couldn't find the man who killed 3,000 Americans because he was probably wearing women's clothing!


Yeah right!


They found Noriega and Saddam<span style="text-decoration: line-through">'s double</span> quickly enough - and they didn't kill any innocent Americans.



They couldn't find the guy because he was blasted dead.
</div></div>

who died on May 2? the wives currently in custody Pakistan - who did they witness being killed? who were they married to?

[jah_yout]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold">they are essentially the same type of man</span>.</div></div>

i totally disagree with this---

malcolm x was raised by a black garveyite mother &amp; a father who was likely lynched by KKK members;
obama was raised by a white woman in hawaii &amp; indonesia- not exactly hotbeds of the american civil rights movement...

malcolm did time in lock-down...i have never heard of obama doing any jail time;


malcolm x was a spiritual leader as well as political agitator for his people..
obama is a politician &amp; president of all of america's people- he has no particular concern with blacks per se, nor should he- it is simply not in his job description-- in fact it is political suicide for him to associate too closely with black issues;

malcolm x would have sounded like rev. jerry wright more than he would have sounded like obama..

the real denunciation would have been obama denouncing malcolm x...just as he denounced rev. wright;

happy earthday today to the x-man sed speed.. R.I.P.
legendary

[Derek]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MGee</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MGee</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Derek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why don't you factor in the power, reach and efficiency of these organisations?
I'm a little surprised.


And it's forbidden for men to dress up like women. </div></div>

history is replete with the failure of organizations, especially when they operate from hubris.

somehow, i doubt obl or any serious jihadist with a war mindset would care about a thing like wearing women's clothes, if in the end it serves a strategic purpose.

anyhoo, mi a bow out of this convo. </div></div>

Well I hope you don't bow out of this convo because, you're implying that, for TEN YEARS, the CIA couldn't find the man who killed 3,000 Americans because he was probably wearing women's clothing!


Yeah right!


They found Noriega and Saddam<span style="text-decoration: line-through">'s double</span> quickly enough - and they didn't kill any innocent Americans.



They couldn't find the guy because he was blasted dead.
</div></div>

who died on May 2? the wives currently in custody Pakistan - who did they witness being killed? who were they married to? </div></div>


CNN

[johnnycakes]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

&quot;The real denunciation would have been obama denouncing malcolm x...just as he denounced rev. wright;&quot;


Right on j_y,

El haj Malik El Shabazz was roundly rejected not only by many blacks but by both political parties. The fact that Obama was carefully checked out and ACCEPTED by the overwhelmingly white and wealth driven Democrat Party should tell any thinking person that Obama was one of them and not one of those &quot;dangerous&quot; and &quot;scary' blacks like Malik.

And if that acceptance by the white establishment isn't sufficient, Obama's record so far which is more or less a continuation of the Bush administration should prove that Obama would have nothing good to say about Malik.

Obama gave a big speech today on the Middle East.

I'm still waiting for him to mention Malik.



Further, how can Obama , who was born in Hawaii, went to Harvard is a well to do man and who has never fully experienced racist oppression in any way relate to the ghetto experiences and the righteousness of the Malik's words?
Obama is no more typical or representative of the American black experience than is any other well-to-do person.

[mountaingal]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jah_yout</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold">they are essentially the same type of man</span>.</div></div>

i totally disagree with this---

malcolm x was raised by a black garveyite mother &amp; a father who was likely lynched by KKK members;
obama was raised by a white woman in hawaii &amp; indonesia- not exactly hotbeds of the american civil rights movement...

malcolm did time in lock-down...i have never heard of obama doing any jail time;


malcolm x was a spiritual leader as well as political agitator for his people..
obama is a politician &amp; president of all of america's people- he has no particular concern with blacks per se, nor should he- it is simply not in his job description-- in fact it is political suicide for him to associate too closely with black issues;

malcolm x would have sounded like rev. jerry wright more than he would have sounded like obama..

the real denunciation would have been obama denouncing malcolm x...just as he denounced rev. wright;

happy earthday today to the x-man sed speed.. R.I.P.
legendary </div></div>

in terms of their innate qualities - their self-identity, their abiding by a personal moral code, their intellectual approach to life and issues - malcolm and barack are more alike than not.i do believe that.

it is entirely possible for people to grow out of different life experiences and have a similar outlook and approach. just as someone could grow just like how malcolm did, but end up being completely different - perhaps stuck in self hate.

[johnnycakes]

Re: What Would Malcolm Say About Obama

Malik NEVER sold out to the establishment and would never compromise principles like Obama has always done because Obama is a proud and loyal member of the establishment and notably the Democrat Party.

Obama like many well-to-do rich people has either forgotten the lives of deprivation lead by so many or he just doesn't care.

I do appreciate MGee's long post for revealing what lies behind his/her thoughts on Obama. While there are far too many things in that post with which I (and I think, Malik) would disagree it is clear and helps me to understand where the support for Obama is based.

I also find the wide differences in the political consciousness on this matter interesting since I am old enough to remember Malik when he was Malcolm X , his way of thinking and how that so differs from so many views like MGee's that I follow here.


I have been called a racist too often here to use the term that Malcolm would have used to describe what Obama is and I do not think that the Malik who evolved would have anything better to say about him