Jamaicans-among-survivors-of-boat-tragedy-off-miami-beach..my people come to dis

[Tropicana]

all those numbers/rankings don't mean a thing on a personal level.

That is a totally different matter. There is the personal level and there is comparison to other parts of the world. Two totally different discussion.

if you used to what in your mind is a very comfortable l life and yuh get sent back to jamaica to batta it might seem like hell on earth to you...

Since you took this discussion to a personal level, you forget that after growing up in Canada I did move back to Jamaica and I loved it. I had a ball living and working there. I came back to get married and with the full intention of saving money returning and raising a family there. In a marriage, it takes 2 to tango and teamwork. That was lacking and once a child was in the picture and we split up. I had to stay where the father was. There are so many children with fathers who refuse to get involved it would have been truly selfish to tear my son away from my dad in search of my own happiness.

Life doesn't always work out the way you want it to.

and how many countries are worse off don't mean a thing .

Again depends on what level we're discussing. Now I don't for a second agree with these ridiculous deportation laws. They are applied to Black people more than any other group, especially Jamaicans.

Canada is no paradise and I will be the first to pon it but there are opportunities to get an education here if one makes half an effort. Jamaica has far more opportunities now than when my parents left and I do see young cousins taking advantage of the opportunities to get an education and improve themselves. So yes in comparison to many countries in the world, people are a lot better off in Jamaica. We face significant challenges...absolutely but we love whine, belly ache and focusing on the part of the glass that is half empty too much. Those who are doing the most whining aren't the worst off by any stretch of the imagination. Perhaps some of our people need to spend time in Haiti, Afghanistan or Burundi or working in the sugar canes of the Dominican Republic to put things in perspective.....and I am not talking about the people suffering in the ghetto when I say that but some of the Upper St. Andrew housewives who love whine and complain too much. If some of them knew what it takes to produce sugar maybe they would not be complain the next time they have trouble getting the sugar like we have in the USA and Canada... or cornflakes

[Peasie]

but some of the Upper St. Andrew housewives who love whine and complain too much. If some of them knew what it takes to produce sugar maybe they would not be complain the next time they have trouble getting the sugar like we have in the USA and Canada... or cornflakes

When was the last time you were in Kingston? 30 years ago?

[Tropicana]

When was the last time you were in Kingston? 30 years ago?

Nope much more recently than that but I don't have to be in Kingston to hear them complain. Dem ave someting name telephone and e-mail you know and someting name airplane fe carry people come up yah fe visit. If is not the sugar is the cornflakes or the toilet papah too rough. Always whining and complaining about something. Anyone who try tell me dem is not a set a whining complainahs is dem a tell. Rosie says it so much better...mek mi go find rosie.

[Tuff Gong]

I have to call my mom on this one.
One of the survivors is about the right age, last name and past, to be a cousin. Just not sure of the First name.

[RichD]

That is a totally different matter. There is the personal level and there is comparison to other parts of the world. Two totally different discussion.


Since you took this discussion to a personal level, you forget that after growing up in Canada I did move back to Jamaica and I loved it. I had a ball living and working there. I came back to get married and with the full intention of saving money returning and raising a family there. In a marriage, it takes 2 to tango and teamwork. That was lacking and once a child was in the picture and we split up. I had to stay where the father was. There are so many children with fathers who refuse to get involved it would have been truly selfish to tear my son away from my dad in search of my own happiness.

Life doesn't always work out the way you want it to.


Again depends on what level we're discussing. Now I don't for a second agree with these ridiculous deportation laws. They are applied to Black people more than any other group, especially Jamaicans.

Canada is no paradise and I will be the first to pon it but there are opportunities to get an education here if one makes half an effort. Jamaica has far more opportunities now than when my parents left and I do see young cousins taking advantage of the opportunities to get an education and improve themselves. So yes in comparison to many countries in the world, people are a lot better off in Jamaica. We face significant challenges...absolutely but we love whine, belly ache and focusing on the part of the glass that is half empty too much. Those who are doing the most whining aren't the worst off by any stretch of the imagination. Perhaps some of our people need to spend time in Haiti, Afghanistan or Burundi or working in the sugar canes of the Dominican Republic to put things in perspective.....and I am not talking about the people suffering in the ghetto when I say that but some of the Upper St. Andrew housewives who love whine and complain too much. If some of them knew what it takes to produce sugar maybe they would not be complain the next time they have trouble getting the sugar like we have in the USA and Canada... or cornflakes

how is any of that relevant to the reason the 4 Jamaicans mentioned in this story thought it worth the risk to take a boat from the Bahamas to Florida?


yuh forget yuh said this?

Jamaica is not that bad...these people are nuts.

that is why i "took it to a personal level" the personal level of the subjects of this news story.

[RichD]

When was the last time you were in Kingston? 30 years ago?

the cornflakes comment really have me wondering too

because cornflakes free up form the 80's

[Tropicana]

I do not know anything about the subjects of the news story. I did not even read the news story so my comment could hardly be personal.

My point is that conditions are not SO bad in Jamaica compared to other places like Haiti that people should feel the need to take such drastic action.

Some a onno jus love complain too much. Not saying that a significant percentage of the population doesn't face some real challenges but there are far more opportunities than there were years ago and no need for people to be risking their lives to get to Miami. So I stand by my comment that they are nuts to attempt this.

[RichD]

I do not know anything about the subjects of the news story. I did not even read the news story so my comment could hardly be personal.

My point is that conditions are not SO bad in Jamaica compared to other places like Haiti that people should feel the need to take such drastic action.

Some a onno jus love complain too much. Not saying that a significant percentage of the population doesn't face some real challenges but there are far more opportunities than there were years ago and no need for people to be risking their lives to get to Miami. So I stand by my comment that they are nuts to attempt this.

so if you never read the story how you could make this comment?

Jamaica is not that bad...these people are nuts.

[Tropicana]

the cornflakes comment really have me wondering too

because cornflakes free up form the 80's

Doesn't matter. I am giving you some examples that show you how long the whining and complaining has been going on....if there aren't complaints about sugar, it's cornflakes, if it's not cornflakes, it's rough toilet paper. I haven't heard any complaints about cornflakes recently but I used to hear kevetching and belly aching about it and complaining continues to this day. Always something to complain about.

[Tropicana]

so if you never read the story how you could make this comment?

Easily. Roll your eyes as much as you like. Whether you and others want to admit it or not conditions in Jamaica are not as bad as in many other places. If someone is earning $3 a day cutting sugar cane, I can understand them taking their chances and heading for Miami in a rickety boat. There is no need for anyone in Jamaica to take such drastic action.

[Tuff Gong]

This a regular thing not for just Jamaicans but other nationalities. People live here for years and establish roots etc. They get deported and they come back through Bahamas...They return to their regular life.

I also think that in this case these Jamaicans are not necessarily running away from economically bad conditions but returning (as you pointed out), to a previous Zip Code to resume their lifestyles.

[Tuff Gong]

I don't know how bad Jamaica has to get before some of us admit that things bad.
Bad is relative, but not just relative with regards to say Haiti but relative with regards to what we were and how far we have fallen.
Maybe the time some folks spent here over the years, stalking members and trying to report them for collating and discussing events happening in Jamaica, would have been better spent finding out for ones and ones self, what is really taking place on the Rock?

More and more I read the news I see stories such as this [Where when you read it, two or three times you get the sense of what is happening. The guy is sitting in school hungry on many days and may have had to walk 4 miles to and from school on those days. How many of us knew so much tribulation growing up, even in the darkest hellhole in Jamaica?]:

Needy student is school’s top CSEC performer

Even without taxi fare, Madourie never missed school
BY INGRID BROWN Associate editor — special assignment [email protected]
Monday, October 28, 2013

Read more: http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Seaforth-s-star_15325902#ixzz2j5dT4dVx

[Wahalla]

I don't know how bad Jamaica has to get before some of us admit that things bad.
Bad is relative, but not just relative with regards to say Haiti but relative with regards to what we were and how far we have fallen.
Maybe the time some folks spent here over the years, stalking members and trying to report them for collating and discussing events happening in Jamaica, would have been better spent finding out for ones and ones self, what is really taking place on the Rock?

More and more I read the news I see stories such as this [Where when you read it, two or three times you get the sense of what is happening. The guy is sitting in school hungry on many days and may have had to walk 4 miles to and from school on those days. How many of us knew so much tribulation growing up, even in the darkest hellhole in Jamaica?]:

Needy student is school’s top CSEC performer

Even without taxi fare, Madourie never missed school
BY INGRID BROWN Associate editor — special assignment [email protected]
Monday, October 28, 2013

Read more: http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Seaforth-s-star_15325902#ixzz2j5dT4dVx

The claim that education is free, in Jamaica is disingenuous........(I still resent Manley for this lie he spent years perpetuating).....tuition is free

Deh youth walked up hill too and from school........ never down hill

And note that this would be done on roads without a side walk... and I assume that it would be unlight, given the state pf Jamaica driving it is a miracle he survived without injury! Also note he will have to carry the text books for six classes every day....He started this at age 11...He is not alone....coutnry people just tuffa!

I can make a joke about the hill....I did have a similar scholarly experience.... the 10 mile commute walk. (five mile there and back) to catch a bus., up what is described as cockpit county.. if u missed the bus..U salt...walk an additional 6 miles...

The fall back was an additional mile, and u had to "hop" onto another bus. By Hop I mean Jamaican style... getting onto the moving bus with a closed door as it went round a bend.... ... (the driver was a pocket Hitler who refused to stop.. and the occupant were too stooch to shout at him to stop or open the door for you.. (Rich might get this that was the Munro ladies bus!)...the advantage was there were usually four or 5 guys late and they esprit de corp meant the first one would open the door... and the others scramble on... . (one ocassion I was about 13 at the time I was the smallest in the group... and the bigger guy jumped back off the bus, holding the door handle ran along side the bus extended his free hand back...I sprintted along side the bus grabbed on to the extended hand and he spun me round and by the centrifugal force I got flung into the open door.... About three years later I did the exact same move as a fulcrum point... with two ..

course when I brought this up I was told that we should be grateful that the school provided transport... and we should not get on the bus... and it is our fault if we were late..

course when u caught the fall back position, you got punished as you missed two classes, which made u miss the evening bus home! So that was a noble, life affirming, not so bad trek to look forward to!....That is why I believe Jamaican system of education is Sadism, policed by a set of self important unsympathetic Christians...

Here was my idealised schedule... up 5.30...leave house at 0615. 1 hour and a quarter walk...Bus arrived at 0745..... School finished at 315... there were compulsory extra curriculum activities. Just say my ..Bus left at 1730 trek began at 1815.. arrived home at 1930..... Just in time to help wid the livestock, by the last ray of the sun..... . then home work, ...ah the Joys of "Home Sweet Home" style lamps!

Now given that the three school busses were used to transport school teams to other schools what happened moi when they were not there ???? Ah Wahalla dont be selfish... u can walk 6 miles after doing a 5 mile cross country run!

Ah those halycon days of youth... did leave me one skill I have great leg muscle memory and still have amazing cardio capacity despite a couple penetrative traumas to my lungs resulted in 75% of standard capacity.......

I was talking the other day to a guy (whom I am told I am) who did that trek with me... He told me he measured the distance and it was more than 5 miles... But if I did put the true amount it would seem like boasting.....plus we did do a short cut if there was enough light that involved running down a 1 in 3 gradient and scrambing up a 1 in two! And it also went through a couple ganja fields.... Just say I know I can out run Jamaican dogs down hill !

[Gen]

After graduating from college, Hoyes says he “played around with being an artist” until he returned to Jamaica in 1978 and was shocked by what he saw. The country was going through a turbulent time, rife with political violence. One night police kicked in the door of the house where Hoyes was staying with his mother and sister, claiming that they looking for guns. When Hoyes complained, he received a rifle-butt blow to the head.


“That was sobering,” he says quietly. He returned to California, living homeless on Venice Beach, but he was more serious about his art.




yup, I remember the 70s, as if it were yesterday.

[FLUFFY]

I see how badly immigration does some innocent law abiding persons who just want a lil bly in life and cant get it the right way. Hence, why I do not knock the banana boat.