Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[jah_yout]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
zeko speaking out on it's own does not solve problems. if africans could solve problems by voicing objections then whole millions of people would no be dying...from aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc

what you expect them to do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering the fact that it is Africans that are responsible for the a lot of what is going on in Africa - who should we advocate for. As for "aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc"

Aids - majority of African countries will not accept any treatment - except infantile rape.
Malaria - Let me know who have a world wide eradication programme for Mosquitoes. - The medications available are overlooked and the local witchdoctor is the dr. of choice.
TB - same as above.
Starvation - have you ever met an African Farmer (Black)?
War - Africans killing Africans - Who do you advocate for?
Ethnic Cleansing - See above...

Sorry, but being told to "mind my own business" so many time is all I can take.

I guess I have to take the beam out of my own eye (Jamaica and her problems) before I try to take the beam out of Africa's eys.

[/ QUOTE ]


zeko...apparently you have a lot to learn about africa...do some research (i feel like the caveman in the geico ad)...
it's a huge continent...& it's not just bushmen & forest dwellers...there are also highly developed areas with modern facilities, stock exchanges & all that...do some independent research and not just what you see on tv or read in books written by people with a bias against the so-called 'dark continent'....dark only because they've robbed it of it's light & wealth...unfortunately nowadays many brainwashed africans on the continent & in the diaspora are feverishly carrying out the illuminati's works...but slowly the words of the prophets like j.a. rogers, marcus garvey, malcolm x, bob marley, dr. ben, dr john henry clarke, garnet silk are reaching them & they're realizing...one day they will be powerful enough to overthrow the wicked...so jah say

[una nina]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
zeko speaking out on it's own does not solve problems. if africans could solve problems by voicing objections then whole millions of people would no be dying...from aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc

what you expect them to do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering the fact that it is Africans that are responsible for the a lot of what is going on in Africa - who should we advocate for. As for "aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc"

Aids - majority of African countries will not accept any treatment - except infantile rape.
Malaria - Let me know who have a world wide eradication programme for Mosquitoes. - The medications available are overlooked and the local witchdoctor is the dr. of choice.
TB - same as above.
Starvation - have you ever met an African Farmer (Black)?
War - Africans killing Africans - Who do you advocate for?
Ethnic Cleansing - See above...

Sorry, but being told to "mind my own business" so many time is all I can take.

I guess I have to take the beam out of my own eye (Jamaica and her problems) before I try to take the beam out of Africa's eys.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't give up on them...EDUCATE THEM! If they say they don't want help, you have to show them that they NEED help.

What planet are you from Zeko? There are advances being made in many countries regarding AIDS! Now that some of the big corporate pharaceutical companies are lowering the cost of drugs, many are getting the drugs they need. They are also getting counseling.

I take offense to your term of "local witchdoctor." DON'T YOU KNOW THAT MANY OF THE DRUGS YOU USE TODAY ARE DIRECTLY RELATED TO THAT "WITCHDOCTOR" YOU SO ARROGANTLY DEFILE? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

You may think I'm lying, but I used to DATE a guy from Tanzania who, believe it or not, farmed and raised cattle! What in the world would make you make such a statement about Black farmers? Also, there are many Black farmers in America too. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Wars are complex things...I will post on this later today JUST FOR YOU. i want you to read it carefully.

You need to get out more.

[Tuff Gong]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
zeko speaking out on it's own does not solve problems. if africans could solve problems by voicing objections then whole millions of people would no be dying...from aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc

what you expect them to do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering the fact that it is Africans that are responsible for the a lot of what is going on in Africa - who should we advocate for. As for "aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc"

Aids - majority of African countries will not accept any treatment - except infantile rape.
Malaria - Let me know who have a world wide eradication programme for Mosquitoes. - The medications available are overlooked and the local witchdoctor is the dr. of choice.
TB - same as above.
Starvation - have you ever met an African Farmer (Black)?
War - Africans killing Africans - Who do you advocate for?
Ethnic Cleansing - See above...

Sorry, but being told to "mind my own business" so many time is all I can take.

I guess I have to take the beam out of my own eye (Jamaica and her problems) before I try to take the beam out of Africa's eys.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes Africans need to liberate Zimbabwe and their world.

[cris]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

nina i am not being negative but practical. you can not solve problems if you are too caught up in emotions. and I do not agree that the issue is that american/black/african people do not care or are not willing to speak up. the issue is there are no answers that are quick or easy to implement. you are talking about 1-2 million people displaced. any commitment to them is long-term and america already has long term commitments with Israel and Iraq that are extremely costly and arguably unproductive.

anyway, many universities and state gov.s are divesting all over the place from multinationals doing biz in sudan and maybe it will have some impact on the sudanese government by reducing their revenues enough to lower their ability to purchase arms and back the militas but as rwanda has shown you don't need a whole heap of guns to do mass murder and divestment could make the problem worse by hindering the sudanese economy.

letter writings not gonna make it is all i'm sayin [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[Zeko]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
zeko speaking out on it's own does not solve problems. if africans could solve problems by voicing objections then whole millions of people would no be dying...from aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc

what you expect them to do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering the fact that it is Africans that are responsible for the a lot of what is going on in Africa - who should we advocate for. As for "aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc"

Aids - majority of African countries will not accept any treatment - except infantile rape.
Malaria - Let me know who have a world wide eradication programme for Mosquitoes. - The medications available are overlooked and the local witchdoctor is the dr. of choice.
TB - same as above.
Starvation - have you ever met an African Farmer (Black)?
War - Africans killing Africans - Who do you advocate for?
Ethnic Cleansing - See above...

Sorry, but being told to "mind my own business" so many time is all I can take.

I guess I have to take the beam out of my own eye (Jamaica and her problems) before I try to take the beam out of Africa's eys.

[/ QUOTE ]


zeko...apparently you have a lot to learn about africa...do some research (i feel like the caveman in the geico ad)...
it's a huge continent...& it's not just bushmen & forest dwellers...there are also highly developed areas with modern facilities, stock exchanges & all that...do some independent research and not just what you see on tv or read in books written by people with a bias against the so-called 'dark continent'....dark only because they've robbed it of it's light & wealth...unfortunately nowadays many brainwashed africans on the continent & in the diaspora are feverishly carrying out the illuminati's works...but slowly the words of the prophets like j.a. rogers, marcus garvey, malcolm x, bob marley, dr. ben, dr john henry clarke, garnet silk are reaching them & they're realizing...one day they will be powerful enough to overthrow the wicked...so jah say

[/ QUOTE ]

JY - for 15 years as a consultant - approx 8 years have been spent working on the African continent - As I have said - I have seen first hand what is going on in these countries first hand - I have not seen a white man with a machete or a rifle.

Research...???I was in the Congo during the uprising there - it was not pretty - and it was not for a lack of education or food and money - it was just greed, malice and the meer fact that one Black African wanted to kill another Black African - nothing else.

Do not tell me about Bob and Malcolm X - their teachings have been in vain - nothing - except and nuclear fall out can stop what has been going on - this has been going on for oter 2000 years and we are hoping to change things overnight.

Like I always said, it was Black African in Africa - Selling other Black Africans as slaves - and it is still being done today. Even in these so, called big modern cities - it is worst than in the country sides.

There are exceptions - of course - but I get so frustrated when people on the outside in their rose-coloured glasses think that they can solve the world's problems with speaking out - these people need more than lip service - but remember, before we go barging into their lives to make changes - Remember Iraq...

Sad...but true.

[una nina]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
nina i am not being negative but practical. you can not solve problems if you are too caught up in emotions. and I do not agree that the issue is that american/black/african people do not care or are not willing to speak up. the issue is there are no answers that are quick or easy to implement. you are talking about 1-2 million people displaced. any commitment to them is long-term and america already has long term commitments with Israel and Iraq that are extremely costly and arguably unproductive.

anyway, many universities and state gov.s are divesting all over the place from multinationals doing biz in sudan and maybe it will have some impact on the sudanese government by reducing their revenues enough to lower their ability to purchase arms and back the militas but as rwanda has shown you don't need a whole heap of guns to do mass murder and divestment could make the problem worse by hindering the sudanese economy.

letter writings not gonna make it is all i'm sayin [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay Cris, I agree that writing letters is a small thing, but look at it this way...if enough people write letters, the MEDIA will pick up on it more, when that happens, people will start practicing civil disobedience (picketing, marching, etc), when that happens, the prez noticies and eventually gathers people to be "change agents." The prez can also put economic sanctions on that gov't.

They are busy with Iraq and with Israel [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img] but who says a group of people from all over can't be instructed to come up with a WORKING PLAN? The problem with Iraq is that bean-head Dubya had no plan. Anyway, with this plan, we have goals and ways to reach the goals. The UN and other countries cna help train a military (police) force.

I mean, we're spending BILLIONS to go back to the stupid moon, we can spend money on paying people to train their police.

Yes, I get emotional...thank you for checking me...cause I CAN get carried away! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Just seems like we CAN do things...if we REALLY wanted to. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] Then again, I'm a hopeless romantic! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Your comments have given me hope though...hopefully the universities can cause some change...

Peace, Cris! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/70459-hugs.gif[/img]

[una nina]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]


JY - for 15 years as a consultant - approx 8 years have been spent working on the African continent - As I have said - I have seen first hand what is going on in these countries first hand - I have not seen a white man with a machete or a rifle.

Research...???I was in the Congo during the uprising there - it was not pretty - and it was not for a lack of education or food and money - it was just greed, malice and the meer fact that one Black African wanted to kill another Black African - nothing else.

Do not tell me about Bob and Malcolm X - their teachings have been in vain - nothing - except and nuclear fall out can stop what has been going on - this has been going on for oter 2000 years and we are hoping to change things overnight.

Like I always said, it was Black African in Africa - Selling other Black Africans as slaves - and it is still being done today. Even in these so, called big modern cities - it is worst than in the country sides.

There are exceptions - of course - but I get so frustrated when people on the outside in their rose-coloured glasses think that they can solve the world's problems with speaking out - these people need more than lip service - but remember, before we go barging into their lives to make changes - Remember Iraq...

Sad...but true.

[/ QUOTE ]

Much of this is due to colonization...different groups existed peacefully until then! I MUST share some things with you regarding colonization of Africa SOON...but i hungy...back soon.

[Zeko]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
zeko speaking out on it's own does not solve problems. if africans could solve problems by voicing objections then whole millions of people would no be dying...from aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc

what you expect them to do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering the fact that it is Africans that are responsible for the a lot of what is going on in Africa - who should we advocate for. As for "aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc"

Aids - majority of African countries will not accept any treatment - except infantile rape.
Malaria - Let me know who have a world wide eradication programme for Mosquitoes. - The medications available are overlooked and the local witchdoctor is the dr. of choice.
TB - same as above.
Starvation - have you ever met an African Farmer (Black)?
War - Africans killing Africans - Who do you advocate for?
Ethnic Cleansing - See above...

Sorry, but being told to "mind my own business" so many time is all I can take.

I guess I have to take the beam out of my own eye (Jamaica and her problems) before I try to take the beam out of Africa's eys.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't give up on them...EDUCATE THEM! If they say they don't want help, you have to show them that they NEED help.

What planet are you from Zeko? There are advances being made in many countries regarding AIDS! Now that some of the big corporate pharaceutical companies are lowering the cost of drugs, many are getting the drugs they need. They are also getting counseling.

I take offense to your term of "local witchdoctor." DON'T YOU KNOW THAT MANY OF THE DRUGS YOU USE TODAY ARE DIRECTLY RELATED TO THAT "WITCHDOCTOR" YOU SO ARROGANTLY DEFILE? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

You may think I'm lying, but I used to DATE a guy from Tanzania who, believe it or not, farmed and raised cattle! What in the world would make you make such a statement about Black farmers? Also, there are many Black farmers in America too. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Wars are complex things...I will post on this later today JUST FOR YOU. i want you to read it carefully.

You need to get out more.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess dating an african makes you an authority on the plight of the African nation - and measly 8 years as a consultant working in Africa does not compare to your vast knowledge...

as for getting out more - I have been out enough, seen enough, hear enough and done enough to say - I have had enough...

[cris]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
cris yuh eva tink seh de merican gov behine all a de sudan business cah dem want de ile ova deh? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

i guess it's possible the gov. saw this coming and is letting it go on till it reaches critical point for them to come in save the day and walk with some oil. do i think they are funding the sudanese gov to destabilize the nation? the way i hear condi rice and colin powell talk about sudan makes me think no the gov can not be that sinister.

what i think is the sudanese gov is taking advantage of the current war in iraq same way the germans did in WWII. they know nobody really going to bother with them cause all the major players have all eyes on iraq. Most of the casualties will be chalked up to famine and disease as a result of displacement and not murder and everybody knows famine and disease are how things go in africa.

[dahjah]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
cris yuh eva tink seh de merican gov behine all a de sudan business cah dem want de ile ova deh? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

i guess it's possible the gov. saw this coming and is letting it go on till it reaches critical point for them to come in save the day and walk with some oil. do i think they are funding the sudanese gov to destabilize the nation? the way i hear condi rice and colin powell talk about sudan makes me think no the gov can not be that sinister.

[/ QUOTE ]

How can you not think so aftah katrina? Any gov more sinister than the american one? Look how when blk ppl wanted to cross into de nex county ar state dem had police bwoy wid rifles tunn'n back de ppl.

[cris]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out.

[ QUOTE ]
How can you not think so aftah katrina? Any gov more sinister than the american one? Look how when blk ppl wanted to cross into de nex county ar state dem had police bwoy wid rifles tunn'n back de ppl.

[/ QUOTE ]

getting sidetracked but I think there are many govs more sinister than the us gov. north korea probably tops the list. an tek your pick from any gov that sanctions digging a hole, putting a women in it, burying her to her neck, an throwing rocks at her head till she dead.

when i think of katrina i dont see sinister as much as stupidity, lack of leadership and acting in self interest. those state police yu chatting bout where not turning people away out of hatred but fear that their satus quo would be rocked..but that's all hatred is anyway, fear if you ask me

[una nina]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]


I guess dating an african makes you an authority on the plight of the African nation - and measly 8 years as a consultant working in Africa does not compare to your vast knowledge...

as for getting out more - I have been out enough, seen enough, hear enough and done enough to say - I have had enough...

[/ QUOTE ]

No, love...careful STUDY AND RESEARCH is what makes me a KNOWLEDGEABLE person speaking about various African countries. I, by no means called myself an expert, that was YOUR assumption.

If you spent 8 years as a consultant, surely you spoke with "common" people? Did you have a chance to study the history of the area(s) you were in? Then there are factors that may have made the Black ppl there DISTRUST you (were you working for a corporation or for the Peace Corp?)

Then again, perhaps you were so busy consulting, you had little time (or inclination) to find out the WHY. Why do these ppl seem to not care? Why do they fight each other?

Take the "situation" in Rwanda
(from Defending the Spirit: A Black Life in America)

[ QUOTE ]

Rwanda had been saddled with a mean history and a corrupt and vengeful president in Juvenal Habyarimana.

From the beginning in the late 1880s Germany, the original colonial power, had favored Rwanda's minority Tutsi people over its majority Hutus. The Tutsis, who had centuries ago migrated down from around Ethiopia into Rwanda and the neighboring area of Burundi, were tall people with relatively keen features. The Hutus were generally much shorter with broader features. In a place where Aryans were not an available choice, the Germans practiced the racism of relativity.

Whatever modest opportunities existed to be awarded the indegenous people under a colonial regime were made available to the Tutsis. Positions in civil service, opportunities for higher education abroad, and jobs of an consequence throughout the colonial system were given almost exclusively to Tutsis. As a qualification for school places, minimum height requirementswere set, locking out virtually all Hutus.

No doubt there were preexisting ethnic tensions between Tutsis and Hutus. Rwanda and Burundi were, even then, Africa's most densely populated countries. A living was hard to win from the montainous terrain. The simple economics of survival had early on given rise to mutual mistrust. Discriminatory German colonial management policies served only to exacerbate these tensions.

Germany lost its African colonies with its defeat in WWI. Belgium took over in Rwanda and Burundi and left in place the discriminatory structures. When Belgium granted Rwanda and Burundi their independence on July 1, 1962, the deeply resented minority Tutsis found themselves running everything worth running -- the government, the army and all other systems of real authority.

Juvenal Habyarimana, a Hutu, became Rwanda's president after a coup on July 5, 1973. If an ethnically riven Rwanda needed a visionary and conciliatory leader of character, solid traits, forbearance, and wisdom, it would not get its man in Juvenal Habyarimana. He was a corrupt demagogue bent on Hutu revenge against the hated Tutsis. Soon he would begin to train Hutu militia with a clearly stated mission of genocide. Arms had been supplied to him by France and apartheid South Africa. The Bush (I) administration gave him a modest amount of military assistance as well. His program for mass slaughter of the Tutsis was undisguised. Invitations to the killing party had been broadcast on the radio in the capital, Kigali. We knew. Our Policy House knew exactly what President Habyarimana was up to. It didn't seem to matter.



[/ QUOTE ]

After almost 200 years of discrimination against the Hutus by a system created and supported by colonists, is it any wonder that after President Habyarimana of Rwanda and President Ntaryamira of Burundi (both Hutus) were killed in a "suspect" airplane crash that the people finally went mad and "hacked, shot and bludgeoned" each other to death?

Sometimes things happen because of a long history of emotional brainwashing that none of those who are affected by it can see.

If there were an "intervention" (along with a progressive, comprehensive PLAN to create stability) at some point by a trained group of people, this kind of thing may not have happened. It's a tough battle, expensive and sometimes deadly, but IT'S WELL WORTH IT!

Anyway, Zeko, we'll count you out of the struggle, we won't waste your time.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
zeko speaking out on it's own does not solve problems. if africans could solve problems by voicing objections then whole millions of people would no be dying...from aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc

what you expect them to do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering the fact that it is Africans that are responsible for the a lot of what is going on in Africa - who should we advocate for. As for "aids, malaria, TB, starvation, war, ethnic cleansing etc"

Aids - majority of African countries will not accept any treatment - except infantile rape.
Malaria - Let me know who have a world wide eradication programme for Mosquitoes. - The medications available are overlooked and the local witchdoctor is the dr. of choice.
TB - same as above.
Starvation - have you ever met an African Farmer (Black)?
War - Africans killing Africans - Who do you advocate for?
Ethnic Cleansing - See above...

Sorry, but being told to "mind my own business" so many time is all I can take.

I guess I have to take the beam out of my own eye (Jamaica and her problems) before I try to take the beam out of Africa's eys.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't give up on them...EDUCATE THEM! If they say they don't want help, you have to show them that they NEED help.

What planet are you from Zeko? There are advances being made in many countries regarding AIDS! Now that some of the big corporate pharaceutical companies are lowering the cost of drugs, many are getting the drugs they need. They are also getting counseling.

I take offense to your term of "local witchdoctor." DON'T YOU KNOW THAT MANY OF THE DRUGS YOU USE TODAY ARE DIRECTLY RELATED TO THAT "WITCHDOCTOR" YOU SO ARROGANTLY DEFILE? [img]/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

You may think I'm lying, but I used to DATE a guy from Tanzania who, believe it or not, farmed and raised cattle! What in the world would make you make such a statement about Black farmers? Also, there are many Black farmers in America too. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Wars are complex things...I will post on this later today JUST FOR YOU. i want you to read it carefully.

You need to get out more.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess dating an african makes you an authority on the plight of the African nation - and measly 8 years as a consultant working in Africa does not compare to your vast knowledge...

as for getting out more - I have been out enough, seen enough, hear enough and done enough to say - I have had enough...

[/ QUOTE ]
I know something was wrong,but after 8 years of consulting on Africa,I find it intresting that you are still reffering to it as the African nation .Just like the majority of North americans who don't consult on the continent which is remotely controlled by developed countries that devided it and admoinister it to their benefits until this day.
I rarely discuss the plight of Africa because it is difficult co conduct an intyelligent discussion,when the knowledge base of the majoroity is that which is developed in the propoganda depts of those who remotely controls the actions through their puppets down there.

[Dr.Dudd]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

This reminds me of my experience with a so consultant sometime ago who came to Jamaica to set up a project.
All he was intrested in doing is to sell junk equiptment to jamaica at very high prices,funded by loans they exiended at exhorbitant rates,while attempting to buy the finish products at pepper corn prices. Ofcourse it fell through,and in the process i discovered that there were those in the government that was supposed to earn extra ordinary income if it was established. Consulting is not all it is cracked up to be.
beibg a consultant to thied world countries is more like being a fisher man. You give them just enough bait to get a good catch,then you blame them for what you did to them because of their ignorance,and gulibillity.

[mangoskin]

Re: Why don't people of African descent speak out...

[ QUOTE ]
This reminds me of my experience with a so consultant sometime ago who came to Jamaica to set up a project.
All he was intrested in doing is to sell junk equiptment to jamaica at very high prices,funded by loans they exiended at exhorbitant rates,while attempting to buy the finish products at pepper corn prices. Ofcourse it fell through,and in the process i discovered that there were those in the government that was supposed to earn extra ordinary income if it was established. Consulting is not all it is cracked up to be.
beibg a consultant to thied world countries is more like being a fisher man. You give them just enough bait to get a good catch,then you blame them for what you did to them because of their ignorance,and gulibillity.

[/ QUOTE ]

and 'some' of them put together reports using data & programmes from another country (usually their own),
then there are the ones who do their 'research' on the cocktail circuit,
and others who use the local staff to get the info for them,
some never go back home, they go from contract to contract, buy homes, bring their families and even try to open businesses
it's nice work if you can get it.