Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

**Tropicana** · 03-30-2009, 02:35 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

I am only going to comment on one thing. The gun business if of NO interest to me. Tuff Gong....the majority of people in Jamaica are BLACK. Please explain what part of this does not translate into Jamaica being a Black country.

Yes we also have Jamaican Chinese, Jamaican Whites (mostly of Brtish, German, and even a few of Italian heritage who have been there for a couple of generations), Jamaican Lebanese, Jamaican Jews (mostly of Spanish and Portuguese Heritage, Jamaicans of East Indian heritage, and whole heap a mix up blend up...every combination one can think of and then some. You'll find Jamaicans who you would swear were 100% Black with Scottish names, Irish names, Lebanese names, Chinese names, German names, Spanish names, Portuguese names, German names, etc. ALL are Jamaicans.

BUT no matter how you slice and dice it, MOST of us are of African heritage...Black and yes Wahalla, I go by 1 drop rule!! How can you NOT say that Jamaica is a Black country?

Yes we had the 5 flights to Miami during the 1970s...and Black Man Time during the 1980s....I heard that STRAIGHT from the horses mouth when PJ spoke at the JCA in Toronto. (I couldn't believe how much security they had that night from Metro's finest. It was the same I had ever seen it. When Manley visited and other Jamaican PMs and dignitaries visited I had never seen ANYTHING like that.) Anyway, it's not right and no one should be victimized because of race, colour, or creed....but I don't hear you (Tuff Gong) saying a WORD to condemn the White folks who discriminate against Black Jamaicans abroad. In fact, you have mocked me when I have spoken abou it. So what is is supposed to be. A world in which White people have privilege everywhere and we have privilege no where? It must be a level playing field and a level playing field for EVERYONE not just the White folks.

**Tuff Gong** · 03-30-2009, 02:36 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ....the way the arming of blacks is done in jamaica,is ysed to weaking the armed ones by seperating them from the inarmed mases. It is use a sa wedge beyween them. thatt weakens the whole including th eones with the arms...</div></div>
I agree with you, but this is an argument for the arming on Jamaicans to protect the individual and their neighbours against Jamaicans with criminal intent.

This certainly have no central role in a discussion about why Jamaicans were chased out of Jamaica, why so-called black Jamaicans seems to be doing worse than other ethnic minorities and why Jamaica has fell so far behind most countries in the region and the world.

**Dr.Dudd** · 03-30-2009, 02:37 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Diabolical_Tanya</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Originally posted by Dr.Dudd

have you ever wondered why the most powerful country in th ehistorycannot subdue iraq and Afghanistan?? </div></div>no country can subdue a people willing to fight to the end, history is replete with all kinds of examples. </div></div> If they did nt haev a culture of legal gun ownership and adeqyate amounts, they could be dubdues, irresoective of their willingness to die doing so. Palestine before it was turned to Isreal us an example. although th epalestinians were willing to fight to th edeath. they did not get legal arms, while the Jews then had .t

That is jjust one example, world histioty is chock full of them. </div></div>

so the legal guns shoot better than the illegal ones?

OK let be get to kinder class.
No legal arms can be keot and carried where they can be easily accessed to defend one's life and property. illegal guns have to be carefully hidden, so most of th etimethey are not easily accessable. since you don't want police to find it easily. .
Many illegal gin owners do noit keep it in hoeir homes. since of the police search their homes they will either be shot, or go to proson.
Ullegal guns are not as valuable as a deterrent. More as a tool of agression. Most illegal gun owners get killed because of this. and that is why they tend to stay in theor corners,unless they are in a mission to kill.

**gourmet** · 03-30-2009, 02:39 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

If Jamaica is a black country, then there is no place, or only a bad place, for Jamaicans who are not black. It makes a mockery of the national slogan about out of many peoples, one.
I live in Canada. Despite there being a lot of white and Chinese people here, it's neither a white country nor a Chinese country.

**jah_yout** · 03-30-2009, 02:41 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey there ex- hubby watch who you are calling a non-Jamaican. Naturally, ANYONE who grew up not seeing people of every race, creed and colour talking patois would find it fascinating. Same thing happened the first time I saw Black firefighters. It was on a return trip to Jamaica as a pre-schooler. I remember it vividly. I was all excited "oh look, look, look a the Black fireman". A child who grew up in Jamaica wouldn't have been fascinated by that.

</div></div>

dat's why wi separate ennuh
a lie...you are not a non-jamaican
i n i just have to expose you to more of your culture...
nothing a nice extended stay in j-a can't solve

**Tropicana** · 03-30-2009, 02:42 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Jamaica has fell so far behind most countries in the ... <span style="font-weight: bold">the world.</span></div></div>

This is exagerating. We have our problems but we are FAR from rock bottom and I did post figures and stats AT LENGTH to prove this.

**Dr.Dudd** · 03-30-2009, 02:43 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dr.Dudd</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ....the way the arming of blacks is done in jamaica,is ysed to weaking the armed ones by seperating them from the inarmed mases. It is use a sa wedge beyween them. thatt weakens the whole including th eones with the arms...</div></div>
I agree with you, but this is an argument for the arming on Jamaicans to protect the individual and their neighbours against Jamaicans with criminal intent.

This certainly have no central role in a discussion about why Jamaicans were chased out of Jamaica, why so-called black Jamaicans seems to be doing worse than other ethnic minorities and why Jamaica has fell so far behind most countries in the region and the world.
</div></div> It certainly have a relevance to the argument.

since the ones that were chased out,were the ones that had accumulated wealth. the ones that accumulated wealth were the ones that could legally protect that wealth.

The ones that could legally pr=otect their wealth had a legal means to do so. the ones withoput th elegal means to p[rptect theor welth will never be able to accumulate welth.

those that accumulates wealth has a greater influence on the power and control of the economy and selection of political representatives.
So it definately have relevance tothe argument

**Tuff Gong** · 03-30-2009, 02:44 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am only going to comment on one thing. Tuff Gong....the majority of people in Jamaica are BLACK. Please explain what part of this does not translate into Jamaica being a Black country.</div></div>It does not.

The majority of persons in Jamaica have black skin that is an historical fact but many black skinned Jamaicans could have White/Yellow/Brown ancestors and vice versa.

The Motto of Jamaica is Out of Many One People we knew that when we went into Independence and chose our symbols.
The subsequent attempts to delineate people by skin colour are divisive, backward and measures taken in furtherance of that position borders on genocidal ethnic cleansing.

**Tropicana** · 03-30-2009, 02:51 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gourmet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If Jamaica is a black country, then there is no place, or only a bad place, for Jamaicans who are not black. It makes a mockery of the national slogan about out of many peoples, one. </div></div>

This is not true.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I live in Canada. Despite there being a lot of white and Chinese people here, it's neither a white country nor a Chinese country. </div></div>

<span style="font-weight: bold">TOTAL UTTER AND ABSOLUTE GARBAGE!! </span> You mussee just reach!

Don't go by what you see on the subway. In NO way does it reflect the power elite in Canada.

Go read Porter's <span style="font-weight: bold">Vertical Mosaic</span>. Read Hugh MacLennan' Two Solitudes and Pierre Vallieres White N<span style="font-weight: bold">EDIT</span>s of America. Learn about the Asian Exclusion ACT, the head tax on Chinese males, the interment of the Japanese Canadians during WW II. Take a sroll inside most Canadian corporations and see who occupies positions from the level of Manager and up. Go and see who sits in the Board rooms. Drive along Post Road or the Bridle Path. Walk through Rosedale of Upper Westomount. You'll see MOSTLY WHITE people.

<span style="font-weight: bold">THEN COME TALK TO ME BOUT CANADA IS NOT A WHITE COUNTRY!!</span>

**Tropicana** · 03-30-2009, 02:54 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am only going to comment on one thing. Tuff Gong....the majority of people in Jamaica are BLACK. Please explain what part of this does not translate into Jamaica being a Black country.</div></div>
It does not.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The majority of persons in Jamaica have black skin that is an historical fact but many black skinned Jamaicans could have White/Yellow/Brown ancestors and vice versa. </div></div>

Yes, yes I said that

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">and whole heap a mix up blend up...every combination one can think of and then some. You'll find Jamaicans who you would swear were 100% Black with Scottish names, Irish names, Lebanese names, Chinese names, German names, Spanish names, Portuguese names, German names, etc. ALL are Jamaicans </div></div>

On this we agree.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

The Motto of Jamaica is Out of Many One People we knew that when we went into Independence and chose our symbols.

The subsequent attempts to delineate people by skin colour are divisive, backward and measures taken in furtherance of that position borders on genocidal ethnic cleansing. </div></div>

Disagree 100%. How does one take the <span style="font-weight: bold">HUGE LEAP </span>from stating the <span style="font-weight: bold">obvious</span> that the majority of poeple in Jamaica are Black to advocating genocidal ethinic cleansing? You've really lost me here.

**Dr.Dudd** · 03-30-2009, 02:55 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tuff Gong</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am only going to comment on one thing. Tuff Gong....the majority of people in Jamaica are BLACK. Please explain what part of this does not translate into Jamaica being a Black country.</div></div>It does not.

The majority of persons in Jamaica have black skin that is an historical fact but many black skinned Jamaicans could have White/Yellow/Brown ancestors and vice versa.

The Motto of Jamaica is Out of Many One People we knew that when we went into Independence and chose our symbols.
The subsequent attempts to delineate people by skin colour are divisive, backward and measures taken in furtherance of that position borders on genocidal ethnic cleansing. </div></div> As i sad sometime ago in another thread. The motto od the US is the same translated in english as Jamaica"s,and it did notgove american blacks any right they did not fight and lose their lives for. that is because those in p[ower never give yo any unl;ess they are forcewd to. In Jamaica those in piower have noty been forced to g9ve up theirs yet either. akthoigh they claim like blaks really have it and is responsible for what is happenning in the country.
The run away murder rate is cause by th euneqyal access to legal fiere arms. the people wo have it do not want thiose withoput it to have it. they will use every form of pressure to make sure that it never happen. this is because theuy arealuze that the shift of th epower base is in the arms.
They are not going to stop intill ther is a wholesale closedown of the country's economic structure.
and even after that they will stol try to porpve that it won't work.

**RichD** · 03-30-2009, 02:55 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Don't go by what you see on the subway. In NO way does it reflect the power elite in Canada.

</div></div> so is about power elite? let me go look for the post from di odda day....

**gourmet** · 03-30-2009, 02:57 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

Yes, the political/industrial power structure is overwhelmingly white, I agree, but access to that circle is just as closed to whites who aren't part of the circle as it is to people of colour. We are all ruled over by a rich elite who do not act in our best interests.
There are literally 21 families in Canada who own and run the place. I know that is a saying in Jamaica, but it is equally true of Canada. Maybe it's a pattern in all former British colonies.

**Tropicana** · 03-30-2009, 02:59 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tropicana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Don't go by what you see on the subway. In NO way does it reflect the power elite in Canada.

</div></div> so is about power elite?</div></div>

Exactly!

**Tropicana** · 03-30-2009, 02:59 PM

Re: Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gourmet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes, the political/industrial power structure is overwhelmingly white, I agree, but access to that circle is just as closed to whites who aren't part of the circle as it is to people of colour. We are all ruled over by a rich elite who do not act in our best interests.
There are literally 21 families in Canada who own and run the place. I know that is a saying in Jamaica, but it is equally true of Canada. Maybe it's a pattern in all former British colonies. </div></div>

Agreed.

Non-Black Jamaicans in their Own Words

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