Question for those who live in the USA

[RichD]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skelly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">She...no </div></div>

so it was jus the usual hear say ting?

[kia027]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

http://www.politifact.com/subjects/health-care/

[Skelly]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skelly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">She...no </div></div>

so it was jus the usual hear say ting? </div></div>

But of course. Socialism is the boogey man...dem need fi mek republicans tun in dem medicare card and social security..plus di illiterate one dem who cuss liberals but deh pan welfare

[SandiF]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

Yes, I've heard it said that Obamacare is Romney care or whatever it may have been for state of Massachusetts. I have not seen a comparative of the two but I think both have individual mandates and the federal plan from Mr. Obama has that employers may be fined if they have employees qualified for tax credits to purchase insurance. There's no doubt the two plans share similar mandates, etc. The only thing I've heard Romney said repeatedly is what he did for Massachusetts can only work for Massachusetts and it won't work for 4,5,6...50+ states. Romeny can't even explain whether his healthcare plan for Massachusetts is a tax... all I'm hearing him say is &quot;Obamacare is a tax and mine isn't&quot; (not per verbatim but you get it)... He cannot explain why and what makes his distinctly different.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: blakkgiant</div><div class="ubbcode-body">sandif obamacare iss de republikkkans idea. dat y de supreme court neva rejected itt

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SandiF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The first sentence speaks volume...

I'd loosely say that the Republicans are against it because it is not their idea.

</div></div> </div></div>

[blugiant]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: queenb</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You know, Blakkgiant. The more threads I read from you, the more I am convinced that you are a right-wing troll. Your patois makes no sense, nor does your concern for the multi-ethnicity of this country. Every industrialized country has some form of Universal healthcare but the USA.
We are late entering this forum of public healthcare, but late is not too late. It is a work in progress; just as 45 years ago Medicare was and 70+ years ago social security was. Yes, it is not perfect, like a new-born it must be molded and taught and instructed to fit the purposes to which it was intended. </div></div>

wen peeps cyaan challenged mii argument dem attack mii. yess mii surprised aftah awl diss thyme pon yah yu juss realised dat natt datt liberal ar cancervative pon pon moas issues cah mii pon de blakk side. soo yuh tink de future will mekk evereeting awlrite. obamacare iss natt a good bill fe moas blakks

[RichD]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: blakkgiant</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[quote=queenb]obamacare iss natt a good bill fe moas blakks </div></div>

is it less good for blacks than for other races?

[blugiant]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

Nixoncare Finally Wins


<span style="font-weight: bold"> The euphoria in the Obama camp over their health care victory at the U.S. Supreme Court shows “the Democrats of the 21st century are akin to the Republicans of forty years ago.” Back then, Richard Nixon proposed a health care plan very much resembling – and, in some ways, superior to – Obamacare. When the Obama plan goes into effect in 2014, “there will still be nothing to prevent health insurance companies from manipulating the market place and giving Americans access to inferior coverage with high deductibles.”</span>


&quot;The time is at hand this year to bring comprehensive, high-quality health care within the reach of every American. I shall propose a sweeping new program that will assure comprehensive health insurance protection to millions of Americans who cannot now obtain it or afford it.&quot; – Richard Nixon

“Nixon’s plan was in some ways superior to Obama’s because it called for strict federal oversight of the insurance companies.”

The Supreme Court decision to uphold the constitutionality of Barack Obama’s Affordable Care Act has caused a rejoicing among liberals not seen since the 2008 presidential election. The threat of repeal of the legislation now known by friend and foe alike as Obamacare, has united Democrats and Republicans too. The inability of any president to successfully provide universal health care to Americans made the passage and survival of Obamacare seem like a greater victory than it actually was. Republicans are united in thwarting the initiatives of any Democratic president, especially a black one whose very presence causes them to react like one of Pavlov’s dogs.

<span style="font-weight: bold">Barack Obama’s health care plan is very much like a health care plan first presented by another president in 1971. Then president Richard Nixon presented a plan that was very similar to the over-hyped Obamacare. Nixon proposed forcing private insurance companies to cover everyone regardless of prior health condition, with the government subsidizing those unable to pay.</span>

The elation created by the Obama court victory is symptomatic of many things that are very wrong in the American body politic. Once again we see proof that the Democrats of the 21st century are akin to the Republicans of forty years ago. There is no other way to explain their bizarre rejoicing because a bandaid has been placed over a gunshot wound.

“Nixon proposed forcing private insurance companies to cover everyone regardless of prior health condition, with the government subsidizing those unable to pay.”

Nixon’s proposal ultimately failed because the late senator Ted Kennedy opposed it. Kennedy was the Democratic point person on health care and he saw the obvious flaws in a plan which maintained a dependence on the rule of private health insurers. He assumed that an eventual Democratic presidential victory would bring true health care reform, and torpedoed the Nixon initiative which is now being celebrated by Democrats as a progressive triumph.

The Obama plan does address some of the major problems inherent in the current system, such as allowing parents to continue covering young adult children and preventing pre-existing conditions from barring access to coverage. These are certainly worthy goals, but a true single payer, Medicare for all plan would address those problems too, and would also address the biggest obstruction to true health care reform, the reliance on private health insurance companies to provide care for every person.

Private health insurance companies are the problem, and the Affordable Care Act presents a huge windfall for them. When Obama’s plan goes into full effect in 2014, there will still be nothing to prevent health insurance companies from manipulating the market place and giving Americans access to inferior coverage with high deductibles. Medical care bankruptcies will not disappear, and the true death panel, privately run health care, will continue with the help of government dollars. Nixon’s plan was in some ways superior to Obama’s because it called for strict federal oversight of the insurance companies. Greater regulation would have prevented what will now be an inferior and overly expensive system from dictating health care outcomes.

“The true death panel, privately run health care, will continue with the help of government dollars.”

As Vice President Biden famously said, the Obama plan is a “big f*ing deal.” <span style="font-weight: bold">It is a tremendous political victory for Obama but once again we must ask if political victories are also victories for the people. We now have a deeply flawed health care system that is more entrenched than ever. The argument that this plan will eventually lead to a single payer system is highly problematic. Big pharma and health insurance companies were at the negotiating table every step of the way while single payer advocates were locked out. </span>This act solidifies their control over our lives and shows once again the degree to which corporations drive American public policy.

A victory for Obama is not necessarily a victory for the people, even if that political victory causes insanity among Republicans. Scorn from Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh are not necessarily justifications for rejoicing. Republicans can’t strike a blow against Obama in part because he accepted and promoted so many of their policies. From making war around the world, to bailing out the banks, to bailing out health care, Obama and the Democrats act like the Republicans they say are their political enemies.

We are told that Ted Kennedy must be smiling in his grave because his long held dream came true. After living to see only backward steps in the health care system he acknowledged regret at not accepting the Nixon plan. The president who resigned in disgrace ended up winning in the end. Nixon may also be happy in the great beyond. It took a black man and the Democratic party to give him his final political victory.

Margaret Kimberley's Freedom Rider column appears weekly in BAR, and is widely reprinted elsewhere. She maintains a frequently updated blog as well as at http://freedomrider.blogspot.com.


...blackagendareport

[RichD]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

so it could be a lot better...but still not sure why its bad for anybody?

Blu..do you support the repeal?

[Wahalla]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

I dont get anyone who cant see the need for a universal health care system.. ideally free at point of use when needed...Maybe it is because every single Jamaica politicians sees it as the ideal though they lack the resources to implement it....

I find the UK NHS cumbersome, illogical, badly run, disconnected, inefficient but I feel confient that it is there...My children have additional private medical insurance, I dont.... I would like to see it get better...Not remove it...

And while I get that the costs can be prohibitive to a country, I dont get the US right opposition..I get that there

[Ensomgirl]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: queenb</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You know, Blakkgiant. The more threads I read from you, the more I am convinced that you are a right-wing troll. Your patois makes no sense, nor does your concern for the multi-ethnicity of this country. Every industrialized country has some form of Universal healthcare but the USA.
We are late entering this forum of public healthcare, but late is not too late. It is a work in progress; just as 45 years ago Medicare was and 70+ years ago social security was. Yes, it is not perfect, like a new-born it must be molded and taught and instructed to fit the purposes to which it was intended. </div></div>

Very well said.

[Peasie]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<span style="font-size: 17pt"> Obamacare is constitutional, get over it. </span>

<span style="font-size: 17pt">Get your free bumper sticker here
It's constitutional. Get over it.
</span>

[blugiant]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RichD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">so it could be a lot better...but still not sure why its bad for anybody?

Blu..do you support the repeal? </div></div>

bottomline itt mekkinn de heathcare industries more profitable at de xxpense peeps wey ar being force fe buy private healthcare plans. mii natt arguinn against private healthcare plans mii arguinn fe more choices includinn public option dat wood bee less xxpensive ann reduce de guv budget deficits betta. included inn de bill inn tings fe mekk drugs more xxpensive

yess mii tink dem shood ave repeal eeth. too manee peeps a defend itt cah dem doan like oww obama criticcs a gawn instead critiqueinn a badd plan

[blugiant]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wahalla</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont get anyone who cant see the need for a universal health care system.. ideally free at point of use when needed...Maybe it is because every single Jamaica politicians sees it as the ideal though they lack the resources to implement it....

I find the UK NHS cumbersome, illogical, badly run, disconnected, inefficient but I feel confient that it is there...My children have additional private medical insurance, I dont.... I would like to see it get better...Not remove it...

And while I get that the costs can be prohibitive to a country, I dont get the US right opposition..I get that there </div></div>

rund 70 percent aff american waan de public option choice accardinn to moas polls. itt iss more cost effective dan private healthcare plans accardinn to de guv own figgars. obama neva included de public option ann dat iss y manee pon de leff appose obamacare cah obamacare iss de conservative healthcare plan fe enriched de healthcare industrees

[jah_yout]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

So I point to the elephant in the thread--- Canadians -- how is your health care? It's pretty sad that the so-called greatest nation on earth is stuck between the arguments of every person for themself or private insurance subsidies...
Interesting that Obama was against Romneycare before he was for it...and Romney was for Obamacare before he was against it...
Time will tell.

[jamaica_dreamin]

Re: Question for those who live in the USA

[quote=SandiF]I really think Obamacare can work but many people (Republicans namely) are against it but what to expect.. They (Repubs) did not have an idea or a plan towards Healthcare reform but President Obama did...

I believe it could work if state governments would cooperate.

MA offers the option of buying health insurance through a state pool with payments based on income. I looked at the plans and prices and have seen much worse. The state has a high % of residents with health insurance. My brother in MA (anti Obama care) claims it caused the premiums on plans through employers to sky rocket. I think they are still better than here in FL.

&quot;Pink slip Rick&quot; (the idiot gov of Florida has already stated that he will not enact the expansion of Medicaid or state insurance purchasing pool. Because of this Floridians will not benefit but will pay penalties for not having insurance so people will blame Obama and Florida will continue to have high % of uninsured.