If slavery never happened

[rufian]

Re: If slavery never happened

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To see with you.
We had losses too right?
Just give me an example of what you mean by gain opportunity and benefit.
What did our forefathers live and died for in slavery? Whose opportunity and whose benefit?

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DOES THIS IDIOT REALLY SEE A BENEFIT IN THIS DISCUSSION?

what in God's name?

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please restrain yourself. the name calling is not being appreciated - whoever you are refering to. thanks

[Serenity82]

Re: If slavery never happened

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but what is the solution to this blackstar? they have been living for centuries amongst each other and upheld their differences. The issue of black on black crime is our terminology and not their's. To some extent I can understand them because amongst ourselves, the little touch of a lighter tone makes a black person feels that they are white, it is the white people who don't accept this. We should also say that the white people hate themselves for not accepting this whiteness as a similarity.
For me anywhere you put it, if a mixed person is not embracing all of his background then he hates a part of himself. Skin colour and shared relations might be the only thing between the two groups. but is this enough to not see any difference? what about language, norms, religion and everything which makes up the individual?
Are Arabs black?
There are also indians who should identify with blacks or are they excused because they don't live in Africa?
Maybe we should teach dem how to see colour as an argument to stick together and that they should also learn the one-drop rule. I can't see these two groups as one. But the whole thing ridiculous all the same.
Division exist amongst Arabs as it is, why is there a need for further stratification?

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I agree with you, sukuna. I think the "fear" that black people in the Americas have is that if individuals are not "pressured" by society to acknowledge their black heritage, many would renounce it, i.e. those who "pass" as white and Arabs who deny their black heritage.

On the one hand, I do think it has nothing to do with anyone what people want to call themselves or which part of their heritage they wish to celebrate. On the other hand, maybe black people will disappear.

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Guess what, they NEVER will be proud or accept being black until black people get their sh*t together. Because of the condition of black people and how we treat each other even Indians who favor black people - which is a large percentage are treated terribly!

We can discuss historical africa and slavery until we turn blue it won't help us ANY! You can sit here believing viewing yourself as a former slave or this victim of white people will help you or us BUT IT WON'T! You see Q2310's post, most whites, no matter how black friendly they are honestly view their culture and nations as superior. Given our shape, how could they think any differently. Especially with conversations like this.

My god I can't believe people are calling me and Seveen 'self-haters' for loving ourselves and not giving white people power over us in 2006. You can't love yourself if you want to constantly think of us as misplaced and former slaves. We are NOT, discussing slavery has nothing to do with self-hate and sukuna you will NEVER change any white persons attitude that slavery didn't benefit us because they see themselves as superior. Whites, like many other groups, THINK OF THEIR GROUP FIRST in other words they won't be doing sh*t for us anytime soon or even changing anytime soon!

All these racial topics that are going absolutely no where just around in circles. Some of you come across as confused and lost and not sure where to turn next. Here's an idea, love yourself, love your CURRENT culture although embracing our roots(in africa), respect yourself. stop being harsh to other people, black people in particular, stop fighting others who want to become succesful, stop waiting for whites to 'save' us or change because they are not!

[rufian]

Re: If slavery never happened

have you ever seen the film Sankofa? which effect did it have on you?

[Gen]

Re: If slavery never happened

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Is this from a book? Can I purchase it?

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yes it is from a book...the title is How Europe Underdeveloped Africa by Walter Rodney ...i believe it is available thru Amazon

while u r at it...get a copy of his Groundings with my Brethren/Brothers.... ..his definitive piece on Rastafari in Jamaica...enjoy them both [img]/forums/images/graemlins/70409-waytogo.gif[/img]

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Evan...do you remember the date this book was first printed..the one by Walter Rodney...I believe I saw it at home as a child [img]/forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif[/img] mi think a it same one....must be..gonna pick up a copy [img]/forums/images/graemlins/70409-waytogo.gif[/img]

[Serenity82]

Re: If slavery never happened

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have you ever seen the film Sankofa? which effect did it have on you?

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No, and I had no interest in seeing it!

[churchgirl]

Re: If slavery never happened

Serenity, please go back and familiarize yourself with the forum rules, specifically the part on not insulting and using expletives. Do consider this an official warning.

[Seveen]

Re: If slavery never happened

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Am I right in saying that by way of the transatlantic slave era, most if not all of us have gained opportunity and have benefitted by what foreparents lived and died for in those traumatic days?

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[img]/forums/images/graemlins/70409-waytogo.gif[/img]

and MY history book doesn't stop at slavery [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[una nina]

Re: If slavery never happened

MY history books BEGINS with the first man and never ends! Slavery is but a SMALL part of MY glorious history! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/70409-waytogo.gif[/img]

[Seveen]

Re: If slavery never happened

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MY history books BEGINS with the first man and never ends! Slavery is but a SMALL part of MY glorious history! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/70409-waytogo.gif[/img]

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now THAT'S what i'm talking about [img]/forums/images/graemlins/bannana_purple.gif[/img]

[rufian]

Re: If slavery never happened

wouldn't you say that your Jamaican identity began with African slavery?

[una nina]

Re: If slavery never happened

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wouldn't you say that your Jamaican identity began with African slavery?

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Nope. I'm not Jamaican! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Seriously though, I don't know if I understand your question. Just because I cannot trace back to a certain individual or a certain group of people, there is NO denying that I am of African descent.

My identity is that of a person of African descent and part of the Diaspora that was born and raised in the U.S.

Slavery and it's effects on the American psyche only FLAVOR my outlook...but I don't base myself solely on that small and unfortunate part of my LONG heritage.

I don't know if I'm understanding your question...if I don't seem to, let me know! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Seveen]

Re: If slavery never happened

we all started in africa - some of us ended up in jamaica, some brazil, some the USA - these places were not chosen by us voluntarily - and we try and differentiate ourselves using nationality [img]/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

i am sure some of my ancestors ended up going to stops other than the USA - so i can embrace my culture in places other than America because all african descendants are my ancestors

and i'd go back to Africa in a minute and have tried - and like anywhere else there are immigration regulations - can't take jobs from residents, and i don't want to get married - even offered to do some volunteer work in exchange for food and shelter - all reminding me that i'm NOT african anymore [img]/forums/images/graemlins/70402-thinking.gif[/img]

[Blackstar*]

Re: If slavery never happened

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and today the genocide we are experiencing in dafar and the sudan - are black on black crimes <font color="purple"> Seveen, I don't think so. Even though some of the Arabs "look" black, they would take issue to that and because they don't have the total package (thicker lips, dark brown skin, tight curly hair, etc) they do not consider them to be anything close to Black. At least that's my impression when talking to Arabs in the Detroit area..."** </font>

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That's self-hatred, Una.

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How so?

[/ QUOTE ]Some Arabs have black parentage; in wealthy N. African families, men have children with Senegalese and Malian slaves.

[rufian]

Re: If slavery never happened

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wouldn't you say that your Jamaican identity began with African slavery?

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Nope. I'm not Jamaican! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Seriously though, I don't know if I understand your question. Just because I cannot trace back to a certain individual or a certain group of people, there is NO denying that I am of African descent.

My identity is that of a person of African descent and part of the Diaspora that was born and raised in the U.S.

Slavery and it's effects on the American psyche only FLAVOR my outlook...but I don't base myself solely on that small and unfortunate part of my LONG heritage.

I don't know if I'm understanding your question...if I don't seem to, let me know! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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yea, it seems as if you didnt. The Jamaican was just an example. If you are part of the diaspora, black and you now go by a new identity then that identity is a result of African slavery.
how can you acknowledge your new identiy, how can slavery be overlooked when it is the farthest you can look back?

But we have all started discussing not even mentioning slavery. Then again, it could have something to do with how much influences being passed down from generations a back

[rufian]

Re: If slavery never happened

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and today the genocide we are experiencing in dafar and the sudan - are black on black crimes <font color="purple"> Seveen, I don't think so. Even though some of the Arabs "look" black, they would take issue to that and because they don't have the total package (thicker lips, dark brown skin, tight curly hair, etc) they do not consider them to be anything close to Black. At least that's my impression when talking to Arabs in the Detroit area..."** </font>

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That's self-hatred, Una.

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How so?

[/ QUOTE ]Some Arabs have black parentage; in wealthy N. African families, men have children with Senegalese and Malian slaves.

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Interesting to add that the French during slavery dem say, allowed the child of the slave to carry the identity of the father, same thing for Arabs, same thing for all African ethnicities.